Subliminal Talk

(10-15-2018, 12:33 PM)Mr. Anderson Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-15-2018, 11:38 AM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]That seems like an odd reaction. Maybe the fear would have been led to by the emotions being blocked?

Over time, that should stop happening, if it happens again.

Well, I don't know what happened there. The only thought I had was that shutting down everything was the only thing to prevent fear at that moment. But like I said, it looks like the emotions are back, I only noticed some slight attempt of shutdown later the day, but nothing serious.


I had somehow many realizations while on USLM, maybe because one of my goal is to execute DMSI. Most of them are probably covered by the FRM, but I will write them down, maybe it is of use.

1. I had the impression that I resisted subs in the past more on the (semi)conscious level than I thought. Especially because I wanted to have things going my way and not other way, which probably prevented execution in some terms.

That has been becoming more and more apparent as I observe people, that they are resisting more consciously than I realized.

Quote:2. Resistance against ultrasonic/hybrid was probably because the us part is louder and that's not only perceived as being told what to do but it is also perceived as a threat which brings everything to shutdown.

Threat to what?

Quote:3. Emotions can also create fear by themselves as they are unpredictable.

I'm not sure I believe that.

Quote:4. Not everything is fear related and cannot be resolved (directly) through fear removal, because:
a) The patterns which were created through fear in the past seem to remain after fear removal. They will be dissolved with new experiences when fear doesn't prevent new experiences but at the begin they can stand in the way. For example today in the morning while I didn't feel anything I figured out that I wouldn't approach a woman, because I could do something wrong and embarass myself. I didn't feel it, but my mind told my that it is important to no embarass myself as it is important to be flawless. And while I know that the reasons behind are fear related the pattern itself became strong enough during the years to exist by itself.

You haven't lost the fear yet. This invalidates your argument in toto. This is evident by the fact that your argument here is itself based in fear. I see this based at the very least in your assertion that it is important to be flawless, which is perfectionism, which is based in fear that one is not good enough. Without fear you would have done what you started out to do.

Just as a leaf does not exist without the twig that it grows from, which does not exist without the branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the larger branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the trunk from which it grows, which does not exist without the roots from which it grows - a fear pased pattern will not exist without the fear that drives it.

FRM, when executed, will erase all of this. Patterns and habits and all.

Quote:b) That is something I realized while listening to USLM2. At the middle of the first loop I started to feel similar like I felt when I was stonewalling DMSI, but it was still a bit different. I was thinking all the time "You must be kidding me". First I didn't know where it comes from but then I realized that's about the script of the sub. It is like the reality presented by the script is in some cases so far from the reality of the user that the script is being ignored. That's also not fear related. I mean, just imagine a situation. Imagine you are walking down the street and a guy comes around and tells you "Dude, just spread your arms and fly". I mean, you would think this guy is either total crazy or totally wasted because based on your reality you know that you can't fly this way. Therefore you would simply ignore him and maybe even become angry when he insists that you can do it. And I think this is what in some cases happens, because the reality from the user is too far from the reality presented by the script. This of course doesn't mean that people cannot stonewall scripts out of fear.

This is simply an attempt to deny the possibility of what is in the script, and thus shut down the need to execute it. "That's just not possible." Well it is possible, and I know for a fact that it is possible. But even this will be erased when the FRM is fully executed.

(10-15-2018, 04:40 PM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]

Quote:2. Resistance against ultrasonic/hybrid was probably because the us part is louder and that's not only perceived as being told what to do but it is also perceived as a threat which brings everything to shutdown.

Threat to what?

Loud persons were often being perceived as aggressive/violent in my childhood and sometimes still are. So I think the sub might be also perceived as aggressive.

Quote:You haven't lost the fear yet. This invalidates your argument in toto. This is evident by the fact that your argument here is itself based in fear. I see this based at the very least in your assertion that it is important to be flawless, which is perfectionism, which is based in fear that one is not good enough. Without fear you would have done what you started out to do.

Just as a leaf does not exist without the twig that it grows from, which does not exist without the branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the larger branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the trunk from which it grows, which does not exist without the roots from which it grows - a fear pased pattern will not exist without the fear that drives it.

FRM, when executed, will erase all of this. Patterns and habits and all.

Neuronal pathways which were created over years and often used won't disappear overnight. That's why the old habits and thinking patterns will still be preferred at the begin. But without fear new experiences will be made and therefore new pathways will be created much easier than before and the old ones will regress. If you cut off a plant from its root it won't immediately disappear, but will become withered everyday more and more.

Quote:This is simply an attempt to deny the possibility of what is in the script, and thus shut down the need to execute it. "That's just not possible." Well it is possible, and I know for a fact that it is possible. But even this will be erased when the FRM is fully executed.

I don't see it as a fear based attempt but just a conclusion from the users point of view based on his own experienced reality, where the new reality will be seen as not possible and therefore the script is not been taken seriously. I have a very good example of someone in my family who will refuse everything until he will see and experience it by himself.

I know you believe everything is fear based and I am not trying to invalidate the fear theory at whole because fear is a big problem. I know it, because I have a lot of fear - at least when it comes to dealing with people and women. But I think there are some things which aren't directly affected through fear and some maybe not at all. And sometimes decisions can be made which have the same outcome as a fear based reaction, because there might be a good reason to do so.

(10-16-2018, 09:43 AM)Mr. Anderson Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-15-2018, 04:40 PM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]

Quote:2. Resistance against ultrasonic/hybrid was probably because the us part is louder and that's not only perceived as being told what to do but it is also perceived as a threat which brings everything to shutdown.

Threat to what?

Loud persons were often being perceived as aggressive/violent in my childhood and sometimes still are. So I think the sub might be also perceived as aggressive.

Quote:You haven't lost the fear yet. This invalidates your argument in toto. This is evident by the fact that your argument here is itself based in fear. I see this based at the very least in your assertion that it is important to be flawless, which is perfectionism, which is based in fear that one is not good enough. Without fear you would have done what you started out to do.

Just as a leaf does not exist without the twig that it grows from, which does not exist without the branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the larger branch that it grows from, which does not exist without the trunk from which it grows, which does not exist without the roots from which it grows - a fear pased pattern will not exist without the fear that drives it.

FRM, when executed, will erase all of this. Patterns and habits and all.

Neuronal pathways which were created over years and often used won't disappear overnight. That's why the old habits and thinking patterns will still be preferred at the begin. But without fear new experiences will be made and therefore new pathways will be created much easier than before and the old ones will regress. If you cut off a plant from its root it won't immediately disappear, but will become withered everyday more and more.

That makes sense, but it is not guaranteed to be how things go with this module.

Quote:

Quote:This is simply an attempt to deny the possibility of what is in the script, and thus shut down the need to execute it. "That's just not possible." Well it is possible, and I know for a fact that it is possible. But even this will be erased when the FRM is fully executed.

I don't see it as a fear based attempt but just a conclusion from the users point of view based on his own experienced reality, where the new reality will be seen as not possible and therefore the script is not been taken seriously. I have a very good example of someone in my family who will refuse everything until he will see and experience it by himself.

Which is a fear-based reaction.

Quote:I know you believe everything is fear based and I am not trying to invalidate the fear theory at whole because fear is a big problem. I know it, because I have a lot of fear - at least when it comes to dealing with people and women. But I think there are some things which aren't directly affected through fear and some maybe not at all. And sometimes decisions can be made which have the same outcome as a fear based reaction, because there might be a good reason to do so.

Please do share with me. I've been trying to invalidate this fear theory for more than 5 years now, and I have failed. After all, isn't that how we know with certainty that something is what it seems to be? So far as I have seen, all counter-arguments are based on an inadequate understanding of fear and the way the subconscious awareness works. If you can advance my understanding, I would love to have that happen.

(10-16-2018, 09:56 AM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]

Quote:I don't see it as a fear based attempt but just a conclusion from the users point of view based on his own experienced reality, where the new reality will be seen as not possible and therefore the script is not been taken seriously. I have a very good example of someone in my family who will refuse everything until he will see and experience it by himself.

Which is a fear-based reaction.

When the goal of the sub is too far from the perceived reality of the user then I don't see any fear here. For example before planes were invented people were laughed out when they thought that we can fly one day. I think Leonardo da Vinci was one of them. Simply because people thought he is crazy, not because they feared him.

But saying this there might be other cases where people think it could be possible but fear it that much that they choose to hold on their current reality and belief system and simply ignore it therefore.

Quote:Please do share with me. I've been trying to invalidate this fear theory for more than 5 years now, and I have failed. After all, isn't that how we know with certainty that something is what it seems to be? So far as I have seen, all counter-arguments are based on an inadequate understanding of fear and the way the subconscious awareness works. If you can advance my understanding, I would love to have that happen.

Simple example: if someone tells you to jump off the clip you won't do it because you want to live. This is a good reason not to jump off the clip, because you want to reach something in life, whatever it is, business goals, private goals, etc. Some kind of positive motivation. The result here is the same with fear or without fear. It's possible that with other examples it is not that clear like here but the priciples would be the same. Even if it would be something that simple like not wanting to deal with consequences of something and have a nice day instead.

(10-16-2018, 10:30 AM)Mr. Anderson Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-16-2018, 09:56 AM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]

Quote:I don't see it as a fear based attempt but just a conclusion from the users point of view based on his own experienced reality, where the new reality will be seen as not possible and therefore the script is not been taken seriously. I have a very good example of someone in my family who will refuse everything until he will see and experience it by himself.

Which is a fear-based reaction.

When the goal of the sub is too far from the perceived reality of the user then I don't see any fear here. For example before planes were invented people were laughed out when they thought that we can fly one day. I think Leonardo da Vinci was one of them. Simply because people thought he is crazy, not because they feared him.

But saying this there might be other cases where people think it could be possible but fear it that much that they choose to hold on their current reality and belief system and simply ignore it therefore.

And this is an example of not fully understanding how the human subconscious reacts to things, because you're assuming that everything is done as the conscious does it.

If the sub is too far from the perceived reality of the user, then you have a situation in which they react subconsciously with fear because it exists outside of their little reality. What they have accepted as possible and true, which is "safe". There are parts of the subconscious that can see that that is not all there is, that all things are possible, but not all of those parts can handle the fact that all of those things are possible. In cases like this, the person creates a little prison from their beliefs and anything outside that prison is "unsafe" and "scary". They create that prison because they can see that there are things outside it. The prison of their beliefs is designed to hedge out those other things and limit them in ways that they are familiar with, and thus that are "safe". It is simply a fear of the unfamiliar/unknown.

The more limiting and rigid the belief system, the more the fear they are giving away they have at their core. This is why too much skepticism is just as bad as not enough: too much limits the person to reject what is and what is possible, because it threatens their safe and accepted belief system and their accepted world view. If that is wrong, then everything must be re-evaluated, and they have no sense of security in knowing what is what. Even though a prison of beliefs is not an accurate understanding of the big picture.

From our time, we know that heavier than air flight is possible, because we have seen it, and done it. Our reality is built early on to include it. The same would be true for anyone who had never seen a plane, but who had been told early on that they are possible, and maybe had it explained why.

But once we form our world view, things that violate it are responded to according to how much they violate it, and thus threaten our sense of security in knowing what is what. Someone from the 1100s would have built their entire world view on "It's impossible to fly", and thus would reject that possibility as a violation of their world view, as t creates a very uncomfortable possibility that maybe we don't know all of what is what.

But you take someone from that same period of time, and tell them that planes are possible from childhood and they could have the same response we do, because it was included in their world view as it was formed.

Quote:

Quote:Please do share with me. I've been trying to invalidate this fear theory for more than 5 years now, and I have failed. After all, isn't that how we know with certainty that something is what it seems to be? So far as I have seen, all counter-arguments are based on an inadequate understanding of fear and the way the subconscious awareness works. If you can advance my understanding, I would love to have that happen.

Simple example: if someone tells you to jump off the clip you won't do it because you want to live. This is a good reason not to jump off the clip, because you want to reach something in life, whatever it is, business goals, private goals, etc. Some kind of positive motivation. The result here is the same with fear or without fear. It's possible that with other examples it is not that clear like here but the priciples would be the same. Even if it would be something that simple like not wanting to deal with consequences of something and have a nice day instead.

[/quote]

Jumping off a cliff is a red herring in this case. It has nothing to do logically with what the subliminal is telling you to do. The program is telling you that you can make yourself completely successful, and to go do that. There is no correlation between that and being told to jump off a cliff.

(10-16-2018, 11:06 AM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]And this is an example of not fully understanding how the human subconscious reacts to things, because you're assuming that everything is done as the conscious does it.

If the sub is too far from the perceived reality of the user, then you have a situation in which they react subconsciously with fear because it exists outside of their little reality. What they have accepted as possible and true, which is "safe". There are parts of the subconscious that can see that that is not all there is, that all things are possible, but not all of those parts can handle the fact that all of those things are possible. In cases like this, the person creates a little prison from their beliefs and anything outside that prison is "unsafe" and "scary". They create that prison because they can see that there are things outside it. The prison of their beliefs is designed to hedge out those other things and limit them in ways that they are familiar with, and thus that are "safe". It is simply a fear of the unfamiliar/unknown.

The more limiting and rigid the belief system, the more the fear they are giving away they have at their core. This is why too much skepticism is just as bad as not enough: too much limits the person to reject what is and what is possible, because it threatens their safe and accepted belief system and their accepted world view. If that is wrong, then everything must be re-evaluated, and they have no sense of security in knowing what is what. Even though a prison of beliefs is not an accurate understanding of the big picture.

From our time, we know that heavier than air flight is possible, because we have seen it, and done it. Our reality is built early on to include it. The same would be true for anyone who had never seen a plane, but who had been told early on that they are possible, and maybe had it explained why.

But once we form our world view, things that violate it are responded to according to how much they violate it, and thus threaten our sense of security in knowing what is what. Someone from the 1100s would have built their entire world view on "It's impossible to fly", and thus would reject that possibility as a violation of their world view, as t creates a very uncomfortable possibility that maybe we don't know all of what is what.

But you take someone from that same period of time, and tell them that planes are possible from childhood and they could have the same response we do, because it was included in their world view as it was formed.

Ok, I don't know about the subconscious because I didn't do any research here or something. But if we stay for a moment at the out-of-reality example I think that subs with very enthuisiastic goals can at least trigger some extra conscious resistance.

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:Please do share with me. I've been trying to invalidate this fear theory for more than 5 years now, and I have failed. After all, isn't that how we know with certainty that something is what it seems to be? So far as I have seen, all counter-arguments are based on an inadequate understanding of fear and the way the subconscious awareness works. If you can advance my understanding, I would love to have that happen.

Simple example: if someone tells you to jump off the clip you won't do it because you want to live. This is a good reason not to jump off the clip, because you want to reach something in life, whatever it is, business goals, private goals, etc. Some kind of positive motivation. The result here is the same with fear or without fear. It's possible that with other examples it is not that clear like here but the priciples would be the same. Even if it would be something that simple like not wanting to deal with consequences of something and have a nice day instead.

Jumping off a cliff is a red herring in this case. It has nothing to do logically with what the subliminal is telling you to do. The program is telling you that you can make yourself completely successful, and to go do that. There is no correlation between that and being told to jump off a cliff.

I brought up that (extreme) example because I thought the bold statement was related to my sentence that the decisions can sometimes be the same with or without fear because there is a good enough reason to do/not do something.

(10-16-2018, 11:22 AM)Mr. Anderson Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-16-2018, 11:06 AM)Shannon Wrote: [ -> ]And this is an example of not fully understanding how the human subconscious reacts to things, because you're assuming that everything is done as the conscious does it.

If the sub is too far from the perceived reality of the user, then you have a situation in which they react subconsciously with fear because it exists outside of their little reality. What they have accepted as possible and true, which is "safe". There are parts of the subconscious that can see that that is not all there is, that all things are possible, but not all of those parts can handle the fact that all of those things are possible. In cases like this, the person creates a little prison from their beliefs and anything outside that prison is "unsafe" and "scary". They create that prison because they can see that there are things outside it. The prison of their beliefs is designed to hedge out those other things and limit them in ways that they are familiar with, and thus that are "safe". It is simply a fear of the unfamiliar/unknown.

The more limiting and rigid the belief system, the more the fear they are giving away they have at their core. This is why too much skepticism is just as bad as not enough: too much limits the person to reject what is and what is possible, because it threatens their safe and accepted belief system and their accepted world view. If that is wrong, then everything must be re-evaluated, and they have no sense of security in knowing what is what. Even though a prison of beliefs is not an accurate understanding of the big picture.

From our time, we know that heavier than air flight is possible, because we have seen it, and done it. Our reality is built early on to include it. The same would be true for anyone who had never seen a plane, but who had been told early on that they are possible, and maybe had it explained why.

But once we form our world view, things that violate it are responded to according to how much they violate it, and thus threaten our sense of security in knowing what is what. Someone from the 1100s would have built their entire world view on "It's impossible to fly", and thus would reject that possibility as a violation of their world view, as t creates a very uncomfortable possibility that maybe we don't know all of what is what.

But you take someone from that same period of time, and tell them that planes are possible from childhood and they could have the same response we do, because it was included in their world view as it was formed.

Ok, I don't know about the subconscious because I didn't do any research here or something. But if we stay for a moment at the out-of-reality example I think that subs with very enthuisiastic goals can at least trigger some extra conscious resistance.

I'm not sure of that is sarcasm indicating annoyance or not. If it is, I'm not trying to offend you.

Here, though, conscious resistance is again based on the conflict with the accepted world view and the limits it creates on what the person believes is and is not possible.

History is littered with examples of when people did not allow that to stop them, how they achieved "the impossible". Like heavier than air flight.

It still does not challenge my theory that it would be, at it's core, fear that causes the resistance.

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:Please do share with me. I've been trying to invalidate this fear theory for more than 5 years now, and I have failed. After all, isn't that how we know with certainty that something is what it seems to be? So far as I have seen, all counter-arguments are based on an inadequate understanding of fear and the way the subconscious awareness works. If you can advance my understanding, I would love to have that happen.

Simple example: if someone tells you to jump off the clip you won't do it because you want to live. This is a good reason not to jump off the clip, because you want to reach something in life, whatever it is, business goals, private goals, etc. Some kind of positive motivation. The result here is the same with fear or without fear. It's possible that with other examples it is not that clear like here but the priciples would be the same. Even if it would be something that simple like not wanting to deal with consequences of something and have a nice day instead.

Jumping off a cliff is a red herring in this case. It has nothing to do logically with what the subliminal is telling you to do. The program is telling you that you can make yourself completely successful, and to go do that. There is no correlation between that and being told to jump off a cliff.

I brought up that (extreme) example because I thought the bold statement was related to my sentence that the decisions can sometimes be the same with or without fear because there is a good enough reason to do/not do something.

[/quote]

Alright, so what I'm trying to do is point out that examples where it is not fear, but rational thinking making the same choice, are extremely rare. We are capable of making the rational choice (in many cases) but that doesn't change the fact that we do not, at the subconscious level, because the subconscious mind is not rational.

And because of the limits of the conscious mind, the subconscious makes at least 97% of our decisions, from what I have seen. Fear is an emotion, and it is apparently a very addictive emotion. Most people do not make choices rationally. They just think they do.

Ultimately, I'm looking for evidence that my theory is incorrect. So far I haven't found it. I therefore am working to remove and turn that underlying fear off, and if my theory is correct and I can figure out how to turn it off, we should find ourselves suddenly free to accomplish many things we could not before.

Even if we could turn off the fear, Shannon, what about other people? The fact that we have no fear could trigger fear in others, like in my many cases trying for quick online meetups. I had no fear of meeting but the woman clearly did.

(10-16-2018, 11:45 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: [ -> ]Even if we could turn off the fear, Shannon, what about other people? The fact that we have no fear could trigger fear in others, like in my many cases trying for quick online meetups. I had no fear of meeting but the woman clearly did.

Idk how important each is important but I can think of at least 2 motivators behind people actions.

1. Fear
2. Reward

Maybe there is some fear behind the girls decision to not meet with you but I would also work on making the carrot more appealing...

Carrot? So r we calling it that from now onwards? ????

Zane, it is a metaphor for reward. Never heard of the stick & carrot method?

(10-16-2018, 12:41 PM)lano1106 Wrote: [ -> ]Zane, it is a metaphor for reward. Never heard of the stick & carrot method?

I don’t know what women want.

I’ve done my best. I do what I want, self-directed, don’t take shit, living my mission, have a good style, always make the girl cum, good listener, also selfish just enough to not be a people pleaser but not so much to be an asshole (tho some might disagree)

So yeah, I got nothing.

It’s may be because you want women not woman

(10-16-2018, 01:31 PM)san_hal Wrote: [ -> ]It’s may be because you want women not woman

Maybe, maybe not. No way to know.