Subliminal Talk

(03-07-2017, 12:32 PM)Bookstacks DC737 Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-07-2017, 12:24 PM)Darkness Wrote: [ -> ]He needs to see reality.

You want him to see your reality. There's no one single reality for any of us to experience.
Speaking of ego what makes you so well versed on Catman that entitles you to come into this thread and tell a grown man how to live his life?

This not a quantum discussion. This is about how sex life as man is. So that women can start fucking him.

This isn't about entitlement in who do you think you are? tonality in your words. It's about going about having an in the flesh sexual experience. So he can have a sex life.

And ego in the manner that your deluding yourself, when in reality your not as attractive as your mentality suggest to think like such in the first place.

(03-07-2017, 12:32 PM)ReeZoX Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-07-2017, 12:24 PM)Darkness Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have to chill out, I respond to every point with out name calling and without disrespect.

He needs to see reality. All this extra bs, of sex market value, ioi, iod, pua none sense.beta this alpha that. Needs to stop, no man that gets pussy thinks like this.

Rationalizing and hoping and delusion when it's a simple step to start.

Drop the ego, and holier than thou mentality.

With all due respect, you've mentioned your opinion/thoughts multiple times already. If Catman decides to do so it's more likely to be by the 1st up to the 5th time you recommended him to get a hooker. I don't really think the extra 20 really helped.




Whatever you decide Catman, I think I say for everyone when we want you to achieve success with women, the road there is of course up to you. But I think you'd already noticed that you will get a lot of "help" from us. Even when not asked for

All love.

I could not concurr more, if I could call it that

Well lets go back to CatMan. As an unterprenur im sure you know that nothing happens without taking action. If you would like you could try to meet people regularly instead of waiting for DMSI to conjure a miracle! Go out! Speak to people! You dont have to flirt or don anything crazy just try anything.
Take action. When a girl likes you she acts a certain way. You cant tell me NOBODY likes you?

Or you could do what i did and try speaking and having fun with the less attractive ones. You dont want their number or anything like that you just learn more about women and about how to have fun with them.

Thats how i got out anyways. Im only speaking about me, but the only reason im not as successful as i wish to be is because i did not want it bad enough! I did trick myself into thinking am doing everything i can but in reality it was just bs. Life waits for no one, destiny waits for no man and in the end the only things you regret in life are things you did not have the balls to do.

Dont fear rejection, who cares nobodys opinion defined you. What if you get rejected 9 times and then have an awsome woman who loves you the 10th time?
There is something in common with every famus/heroic/legendary person in the world and they all speak the same wisdom.

Your thoughts define your reality. Never give up. Keep trying. Everyone of them says that in their own way in this is the key to win at anything in life. Complaining is usless, regretting is useless.

Think of yourself 10 years from now with the love of your life and then you think back

.... I almost gave up

How scary wouldthat thought be? How much would you regret that?

Or what if you did not have the balls to persue your dream carrier.? Think how poor and sad you would have been. Arent you happy that you kept going untill you achieved your financial success?

Nothing but love for you bro. If i made it! So could you.

I think we need DMSI final to have this as a regular IOI

Hello all!

Wow.

I'm humbled so many of you took time out of your day to write comments on my new journal.

I'll settle a few things I've seen pop up with more information:

-I don't sit idle waiting for the sub to work. I'm very socially extroverted and charismatic, and give DMSI prime opportunities around large groups of attractive females I know in various degrees. In fact, I'm so extroverted and charismatic, that the 3 women in my life who have been told I was a virgin, to this day don't seem to believe it. One in particular is convinced it's a line, lol. That's a credit to me I suppose. I don't fit the stereotype of the introverted guy having issues with women is what I'm saying, and these women seem to have the same view judging by their responses.

-I certainly don't go around telling women I am a virgin. That would indeed probably raise alarm bells in women's heads especially by my age. And/or put pressure on them to live up to some ideal with me. All I want is normalcy, so I wouldn't put that on them ever. The 3 women who know were/are particularly close to me, so I was comfortable telling them. The rest of the tons and tons and tons of women I know in various degrees, have never been told. And due to my personality and demeanor etc. would not have any idea.

-The biggest reason why I would not hire a hooker is because several of my beliefs about myself and women are things like "they're impossible to get", "they only want me for my money/status" "I'm not good enough to get them without that" and the like. So, given those beliefs, that you've all seen remain to be powerful despite the escalation of DMSI's technology, surrendering to paying a woman to have sex with me after all this time for my first time ever, for me would do nothing but just deeply reaffirm those beliefs in reality once more. The EXACT thing I'm trying to stop, I'm actively resisting strengthening those beliefs at any cost, I want them gone and better ones to take their place so maybe DMSI can work for me someday. So, you see, for me, getting a hooker would be the worst thing I could do. Never mind the fact that because there's no real attraction or intimacy it would feel awkward or pointless to me. And I have no interest without that, I don't feel sex has value to me personally without mutual attraction and intimacy. I mean I'd be buying access to a girl who isn't attracted to me, and it only doing it for money. Which feels like I'm selling myself short by buying access and admitting to myself I can never do it without buying it and just strengthening those garbage beliefs about women and myself in my mind, making developing even HARDER than it is now. This isn't just about sex to me, it's about my mind and my beliefs, and not wanting toxic beliefs strengthened through a once in a lifetime experience. That could really set me back. These beliefs have enough history rooted in real life events, trust me on that. I don't think I'd be wise to further strengthen them through more real life events, especially one that is once in a lifetime, that would stick with me forever. I've been looking for real life events to COUNTER these beliefs to remove them once and for all .

However, each one of you has given me things to think about. Including Darkness. I appreciate your genuine real talk feelings and passion about it and all your thoughts on this, you have given me some great points. As have all of you, in fact.

I'm thankful for each one of you, your time, and your thoughts.

CatMan, I'm genuinely curious -- what do you think is the reason for your issue? I know you've HAD to have speculated at some point over the years.

(03-07-2017, 10:04 AM)Illumi Wrote: [ -> ]Women dont care about what you say, they care about how you make them feel

That's it in a nutshell

(03-06-2017, 08:18 PM)CatMan Wrote: [ -> ]The very familiar feeling of futility abound still. Women my age either have kids which I don't want to be involved with, or are no longer attractive (which wouldn't be fair to me as I've spent a lot of time improving my physique so I'd expect at least the same effort in return), and I haven't had any success with even younger women who I am actually attracted to and feel they aren't attracted to me either, so I'm not sure what to do anymore. A feeling still of "it's just too late in life now for me to get success with this even if it does end up somehow working someday" due to this is around. Young women have a huge age gap with me, don't want me, have massive options and chase bad boys anyway, and women my age are not attractive or have kids and are looking for a stable daddy to raise somebody else's kids as a wallet, so there's a feeling of "what's the point if I can't attract young women?" Depression about the situation and the realisation that this program doesn't seem to be working for me, that it's a rigged system unless I can figure out how to be a "bad boy" that they magically swoon for, for some reason. Which I doubt I can pull off as I don't even understand how that works.

Wow. THIS is exactly what went through my mind the whole last month.

(03-07-2017, 03:18 PM)chaosvrgn Wrote: [ -> ]CatMan, I'm genuinely curious -- what do you think is the reason for your issue? I know you've HAD to have speculated at some point over the years.

Hello Chaos!

I took some time to think about this to give what I can. And indeed, I HAVE thought about it so many times since I was a boy. That's been the biggest mystery to me in my entire life...why...Why...WHY...

I have a few theories:

-Due to very poor fortune/luck, whatever you want to call it, I have always been interested in females that were not interested in me. So I've never experienced the "I like you, you like me too" bare minimum necessary for anything to happen. And many of the times, the girls were cruel or hurtful towards me, or simply using my attraction and affection for them to extract things from me or make me look bad. Or being "overinterested" which I didn't even know was a thing, and chasing them away I guess. Being taught to be a nice guy to girls, that's what they want, then being harshly burned in reality so many times by them and learning girls are very different than we are brainwashed to believe. That dissonance has taken me a long time to figure out and actually learn to understand and trust women, I feel very bewildered with them and almost lied to about them. As a result, over time, I felt it was impossible to get a girl, unwanted and unattractive, used to girls not being interested especially ones I find attractive, like something was wrong with me somehow, and felt pain and distrust and futility, as well as fear about girls and them having power over me once I'd get attracted. For a long time I gave up on them and figured it was hopeless it seemed. I'm trying again with some effort the last several years.

-I had some extremely traumatic incidences with girls, one in particular I wrote about before. Short version for those who didn't seen the post(s) about it: a girl in grade 8 liked me apparently. I, as usual, was interested very deeply in a girl who didn't want anything to do with me, but was happy to use me and dangle occasional carrots in front of me. Anyway, when I told that girl, she got angry, ran to two guys, told them I tried to molest her or feel her up etc. Next thing, I'm involved in a big fistfight, hugely outnumbered. I ended up getting my arm badly broken when falling to the ground while holding one of the guys with an arm, while I punched his face with the other. The arm holding him broke. The nurses and teachers at the school did nothing, sent me home with my crumpled arm with a cloth on it. Took me hours and hours to get to my parents, all while in massive pain. When I went back to school, I still had the rep of a "molester rapist that got what he deserved", had zero friends, teachers and all the other kids hated me. After graduating that hell, my parents sent me to a new school system to try to start over yet again, I've been moved around a lot throughout my youth, further complicating my issues probably. Anyway, at THAT school, there were JUST enough "friends of friends", to keep this reputation going for years and years longer, all through high school. Finally, when I left high school, it's gone. Only because I've pretty much severed contact with everyone from that era, and decades have gone by. That's just ONE such incident, but one of the most damaging.

-There's some sexual abuse from a male relative when that age and younger in there as well. There may need to be some assistance in this area needed for something like DMSI. Seems logical to me this could impede progress of the sub, and others like it. Porting over programming from the sexual trauma stuff in E2 might be prudent.

-So overall, I think it's a case of having nothing but pain and negativity and rejection from females my entire life, so I have no idea what the "good" part of them is like, if it exists. Sounds sad, but hey it's what has happened.

I don't pretend to be an expert, I'm just the guy that has lived through all this carnage and trying to make sense of it and learning how to progress away from it finally. These are all just theories as to why I've ended up being such a titanic failure with girls, as it certainly isn't the typical introverted awkward guy stereotype in my case.

Hope that gives some more background for you. And it lets others similar know it's okay to talk about it and use subs to move past these things once and for all.

Day 8, DMSI V3.1-A:

-Dreams I can't make much sense out of. They are either unrelated to females in any way, or they are there, but in a very indirect fashion. Nothing about having sex with them, like others report. Like for example, the other night, I had a dream one of my favourite girls, Ariana Grande and I, were at an exhibit, and she was talking to me and we seemed to be planning how to steal a chair on exhibit from the RMS Titanic! I love the Titanic, and quite fond of her, so those two are clear why they're in my dream. But weird plot line.

-Appetite increase. But no added weight gain on top of that. Also more lax on fasting times, no weight gain even after that.

-Getting less sleep than usual, but still waking up feeling normal. Very different than my experience on V3.0.1, where I was exhausted and sleep hours per day were irrelevant. On this, besides random tiredness which is expected with it, I feel normal. Schadenfreude is what I feel when others are talking about massive exhaustion on this version now, lmao. Just imagine what it was like for me on V3.0.1, I wasn't exaggerating! It ruined my life to be honest. Greatly affected my life. I'm glad that seems to be in the past now due to script improvements.

-A girl I like texted me the other day, I replied, but since then nothing else has happened. I know she's single, she's the one I wrote about awhile ago that broke up with the idiot BF, only to go back and try again. Unsurprisingly, they broke up. I don't seem to get the feeling she's interested in going out at all, unfortunately. We'll see. I have a couple other girls I am attracted to, but I don't have nearly as much urge to push for things with girls anymore. I always have said, I don't know if it's because DMSI is pushing me to become the seduced instead of being "overinterested" (which I still don't see how that's bad and it's confusing that girls don't like guys really genuinely liking them like that) and chasing them away like I always have, or if it's just a feeling of futility and giving up. I can't really tell the difference. Maybe I'm just really starting to question if they're truly worth it to me anymore.

-On this version, I don't get the random pangs of strong horniness, which I like. Before, when I got those, I'd get thoughts of watching porn, which I won't go back to again. But, the thoughts when that horniness kicks in were strong, so I didn't like that. I don't know if there's something in here actively addressing my horniness and response with thoughts of porn, or if it's simply deeper clearing and healing distracting me so I'm not getting the horniness right now.

-Girls popping into my head that I either failed with, or they used me in some way, whatever the case may be. A couple I haven't thought about in a long time as well.

-I feel odd on this version. I don't really know how to verbalise it in a way that can be understood properly.

I think that's about it for now.

Damn, man. That's deep. I totally missed that post about what that chick did to you. It's so ridiculous how a person can just ruin someone else's life in a moment and just move on like nothing ever happened.

I'm a little triggered by your response. There's something about this version that's bringing out a lot of deep, deep, deep pain -- stuff I didn't even know existed or even repressed. And it's making me REALLY empathetic and emotionally available. I've never felt this "open" before.

Truth of the matter is... I think we actually have a lot more in common than you realize and that's probably why I was being so hard on you before. Didn't want to face those issues.

I had a similar incident occur when I was in the 8th grade. I had to attend after school cleanup for some hoodrat sh*t I had done. There was a group of white and mexican girls that had it too. They decided that they were going to jump the [insert racial epithet here]. Unfortunately for them, chaos didn't give a f*ck even when he was a kid, so I fought back -- viciously.

The next day, one of the girls said she was pregnant and I kicked her in the stomach, causing her to have a miscarriage. That stupid lie followed me all the way to high school. I kept having people attack me. Teachers would write me up for the slightest thing. One time, I got written up for defending myself against the bully, and the assistant principal, who "knew" what I had done, colluded with my bus driver to get me expelled from school. The only thing that saved me was the fact that my Mother is often a force of nature and pretty much threatened to drag the principal to hell if she did.

I ended up being suspended for 16 days -- just enough for me to fail that semester and end up having to repeat the 9th grade. Not to mention the experiences I've had with women after that -- none of which give a damn because they can get away with it.

At a certain point -- that point being a few years ago when I was damn near suicidal -- I had to ask myself if I was going to continue allowing other people to dictate who and what I am. And when I said "no," that's when the chaosvrgn was born. It is my imperative now to live the life I want to live, and I make it well known to everyone -- including any woman who would try to destroy my life again -- that I'll burn everything down, her life and mine, before I let her get away with that sh*t. Because I'll always have the ability to rebuild (just as I'm doing now), because I'm better and worth more value.

I know that sounds messed up, but it is what it is. It's what I am and I'm happy with it. At some point, you have to face that same decision. Do you forever allow those people from the past to dictate your future, or will you actively decide who you are.

The next time you're attracted to a woman, just tell her -- yo, you're hot and I want to fuck you. She'll probably turn you down or shit test you, but at least you exerted your will rather than letting her control the frame. And if she dares try to destroy your business, let her know that the by the time the fight is over, even if she "wins," it's definitely not going to feel like that.

lol. Someone's probably thinking, "that started off emotional and ended on a wtf."

Well, I'll end it on my favorite Jean Luc Picard quote ever: "You can commit no mistakes and still lose. That is not a weakness. That is life."

(03-09-2017, 06:42 PM)CatMan Wrote: [ -> ]. Or being "overinterested" which I didn't even know was a thing, and chasing them away I guess.

OK so this is something I've had happen to me as well. I didn't think it was possible either, but with you saying it, I realized that I do that too. A serious issue that needs to be curbed, but I'm not sure how.

(03-09-2017, 07:16 PM)Wharrgarbl Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-09-2017, 06:42 PM)CatMan Wrote: [ -> ]. Or being "overinterested" which I didn't even know was a thing, and chasing them away I guess.

OK so this is something I've had happen to me as well. I didn't think it was possible either, but with you saying it, I realized that I do that too. A serious issue that needs to be curbed, but I'm not sure how.

You can come off as needy, overbearing, desperate...the list of synonyms goes on. Works on low-value women that have no self-esteem. Doesn't work on women worth something.

Basically, the higher a man is in terms of value to a woman sexually, romantically, reproductively... the less interested he will be concerning any one woman.

Regardless of what she looks like, how well she fucks, what she does to get his interest and attention.

Because as such a high value male, he has the magic key to unlimited success with women:

Options.

In other words, when a man has more than woman interested in him because he is high value, the cycle reverses. Let me explain that.

The typical cycle is:

She has boobs, butt, vagina, and he wants it. She therefore has high value and he has less.

But not just "he" wants it... every "he" wants it. And now we have a situation in which the males must compete for her interest, attention and what she brings to the table.

Part of the result is that the less wise ones will start telling her how beautiful she is, how hot she is, how sexy she is. The more they do this, the more other males must do this to "compete". This has two effects on her.

1. It programs her to believe that she is high value and has options, and therefore she (believes) can do whatever she wants and get away with it, because there are no consequences - because no matter what she does, guys will still want what she has to bring to the table and still put up with her bullshit trying to get it.

2. It means that she now notices two types of people exist in the world: Those who want her, and those who don't. She becomes confused by this latter group, because everyone wants her, because she is so hot and valuable, right? "So why don't these other people want me?" She learns that some of them are heterosexual, and are female, and simply aren't interested. She learns that some of them are homosexual, and are male, and simply aren't interested. And she learns that some of them are - gasp - like her: they're so high value that they have OPTIONS!!!

In the natural order of things, low value males will supplicate and high value males will not. When high value women have a heartbeat, low value males will pursue, and the more aggressively they pursue, the higher her opinion of herself and her value goes. That's why even average and ugly women have multiple guys trying to get in their pants, while guys who rate an 8 or even a 9 may still not have options. My girlfriend was chosen because she is the only woman I ever met who I can trust, and because she is sexy to me, but not necessarily sexy by society's standards. She still has at least five guys every day hitting on her and flirting with her. And she has at least one guy stalking her at work.

When a male does not supplicate, she will assume he is gay. When he shows himself to not be gay, she will assume he is higher value, and this interests her because all these guys kissing her butt are supplicating.

Supplicating is not what she wants.

She wants a man who will prove that he is at least as strong as she is, because when she is pregnant she wants to know she is safe still. When she physically cannot run, or defend herself because she is too physically invested in gestating a baby, she needs help staying safe. She is most likely to expect the father to fill that role, because he is the father and (hopefully) is invested in this baby also. This is genetic level instinctual thinking, and it is exactly why most women prefer men with muscles over men without muscles.

When a male has high value, and that value is so high that he can attract the interest of 2+ females, he now has the power. He now has options. He does not NEED any of them, because others will take their place. He now realizes his own high value, and his realization of his high value causes him to believe he is high value, and then think like he is high value, and then act like he is high value.

He begins to say the million dollar word to even high value females:

No.

The cycle is reversed. He now has the power, and she does not. And since this makes him an extraordinarily scarce resource, more females become interested, and his value continues to increase.

This is why "famous people" are high value, regardless of what they look like: everyone knows them, and they are liked by many. Triggering the "high value" social button.

The goal of DMSI is to take you from where you are and put you into the "has options" category. You can have options when one of two things happens:

1. You have multiple females attracted at once because of your muscles, power, money, status, looks, etc.
2. You have multiple females attracted because they believe you have other options, which causes them to respond as if you have other options.

Now here's the good part. If you act, think, believe, speak, move, etc. as if you have other options, women will respond as if you have other options, and then guess what? You automatically have "other options".

DMSI is trying to create this self fulfilling situation for you. But you have to cooperate by doing the "as if" part that it's trying to get you to do.

Awesome post. Not quite sure what I can do with it at this point excatly.. but I like it.