Shannon's Journal Discussion Thread, Vol. 8

[Shannon]

So how are we supposed to overcome guilt shame and fear? Aren't these the things that are responsible for this freeze state in the first place?

If your system has the capacity to move through guilt, shame, and fear without shutting down, then OGSFv3 will probably work just fine if you give it time. But if it continously pushes you into freeze, the issue isn’t resistance, it’s overwhelm. And in my experience, that needs a different approach

I'd like to point out that this is being stated as a fact when in fact it may not be a fact.  I think it's very likely that some part of your subconscious has mastered causing your conscious self to experience fear or some sort of discomfort at it's responses to trying to do anything at all with your G/S/F.  The goal would be to either scare you into stopping, or make it too uncomfortable to continue.  That is a form of resistance.  If you always give up, it knows this is useful and continues.  The subconscious is not stupid by any means.  I can't know for sure, but it surely looks suspicious to me.

I'd like to also point out that the instructions for this program specify that you use it 10 minutes per day at a volume of 2/15 on an Andoid or 2/16 on an iPhone, which is so quiet that you wouldn't be able to hear it at a conscious level.  This program's instructions are aimed at being so gentle that I am honestly not sure how you could possibly experience overwhelm from it.  My girlfriend  is ridiculously sensitive, and even for her, it's been not just effective, but has become the only thing she will use.  

How do you function with that level of sensitivity?  I'm not being sarcastic, I'm genuinely curious - what have you been doing to work with and through this level of sensitivity to trauma aside from subliminals, and what effects has it had?  Is there any conventional therapy or other type of regimen that has had any benefit for you?

[Buz]

@Shannon Will you be upgrading Women Magnet and Sex Magnet to 6G after AM7? I want long term programming and really want to run AM7 and then women magnet?

I hope so too. My second run of Sex Magnet was the best time of my life, I can only imagine what a 6G version would do!

[samba99]

DMSI TID is observed. This will be interesting

[Shawn]

I have finished extracting the script components of DMSI v4.0 from the 5.9G skeleton script. I have also determined that not only should v5.0 include the full FRM, but it of course must be upgraded to FRM v6.1. That has also been done.

I was somehow wondering if a version without FRM could probably solve the problem in a beter way, after I saw you reporting, that your test subliminal is resolving your early childhood issues. Because dealing with the underlying trauma would solve the root problem, while FRM just removes the warning system. So I wondered if that might be a deeper and cleaner solution than just the FRM itself.

[StridingStrider]

DMSI TID is observed. This will be interesting

Oh? Please do tell. I've noticed more looks but I thought it was because I increased the loops to 3 (currently running 3.5).

[callie]

I'd like to point out that this is being stated as a fact when in fact it may not be a fact.  I think it's very likely that some part of your subconscious has mastered causing your conscious self to experience fear or some sort of discomfort at it's responses to trying to do anything at all with your G/S/F.  The goal would be to either scare you into stopping, or make it too uncomfortable to continue.  That is a form of resistance.  If you always give up, it knows this is useful and continues.  The subconscious is not stupid by any means.  I can't know for sure, but it surely looks suspicious to me.

It doesn’t feel like you’re really open to what I am saying. A lot of it seems to get filtered through your idea of everything being mental resistance or avoidance, as if any more complex explanation that doesn’t match your model must be my subconscious being clever or sneaky. There’s a lot of trauma research outside conventional models. I’ve already pointed you in that direction, so I’ll leave that aside for now. What I’m trying to get across is that this cannot be explained away through the lens of mental resistance alone. What you wrote about my subconscious resisting or trying to stop my progress, that’s your theory and it might be true for people dealing with more accessible emotional patterns or stress responses, which are completely valid, but that lens doesn’t capture what’s happening in my system

I will try to explain again. Think about it this way: when you have a startle response, like jumping at a loud noise, your body reacts instantly before your mind has time to process what’s happening. That’s your nervous system kicking in automatically, without conscious control. Freeze works the same way, it’s not something the mind controls, it’s an automatic, involuntary response to overwhelming threat. And when that happens repeatedly over a long period of time, the nervous system can get chronically stuck there

It’s the system operating from survival, a physiological response, which is an important distinction. I know your framework places this in the realm of subconscious resistance. But in the context of trauma, it’s more accurate to say that when the body detects overwhelming threat, the nervous system shifts into a state of immobilization or collapse which is designed to conserve energy and ensure survival. And until that state shifts, you can’t force your way out of it because the capacity simply isn’t there. Framing these responses primarily as subconscious resistance, especially in terms of avoidance or sabotage, misses the physiological basis of trauma responses. Particularly those rooted in precognitive developmental stages. I also want to point out that freeze isn’t a normal stress response. It’s a very high-level stress response, not a typical one, and usually linked to very early and complex trauma

You’ve already acknowledged that your model isn’t developed when it comes to complex or early trauma, and that you can be wrong. So I find it a bit frustrating that you're still comfortable speculating about what my subconscious is or isn’t doing, especially in ways that imply I’m not trying hard enough, that I’m giving up, or being deceived by my own mind. But the truth is I didn’t give up. I spent years pushing through, ignoring my body’s distress signals, convinced, much like you seem to be, that it was all subconscious resistance I needed to override. That mindset is exactly what led me into a state of deep dysregulation that I now can’t find my way out of. So when I push back against this lens, it’s not because I’m avoiding the work, it’s because I tried that approach so many times until it broke down my system’s regulatory capacity and left me chronically dysregulated. Which now makes everything a lot more complex than simply needing more effort or fortitude

I worry this might come across to you as a sophisticated and well articulated excuse that my subconscious is inventing as part of resisting. I’m asking you to try to avoid that. At the end of the day the only thing I’m interested in is finding a way out of this. That also includes constantly questioning even my own assumptions and frameworks

I’d ask you to seriously consider that not every stuck state comes down to mental resistance. That model can often be helpful, but when it’s the only one applied, it risks doing harm. Especially to people dealing with nervous system collapse

I'd like to also point out that the instructions for this program specify that you use it 10 minutes per day at a volume of 2/15 on an Andoid or 2/16 on an iPhone, which is so quiet that you wouldn't be able to hear it at a conscious level.  This program's instructions are aimed at being so gentle that I am honestly not sure how you could possibly experience overwhelm from it.  My girlfriend  is ridiculously sensitive, and even for her, it's been not just effective, but has become the only thing she will use.  

To clarify, I don’t consciously experience overwhelm from the subliminal. My system does. That’s the distinction I’ve been trying to explain again and again. If this were just about mental discomfort, I’d rip the band-aid off and just deal with it. You say you're not sure how something so gentle could cause overwhelm. But your idea seems to assume that overwhelm only exists at the conscious level. That’s not how the nervous system works. The system doesn’t need to consciously register a threat for it to respond. Especially in a dorsal vagal state, even subtle or "inaudible" input can be perceived as danger. That’s not about mental resistance, it’s about the body’s capacity to regulate. If your framework doesn’t account for this, then it’s honestly missing a central part of how trauma functions

You mention your girlfriend being ridiculously sensitive. If you are talking about emotional sensitivity, it isn’t the same as nervous system sensitivity. You can be emotionally sensitive while still having a fairly resilient system. But a system stuck in shutdown mode can react to even subtle or unconscious stimuli as threatening. It’s about capacity. So comparing her experience to mine simply doesn’t apply. Different systems, different baselines, different responses

How do you function with that level of sensitivity?  I'm not being sarcastic, I'm genuinely curious - what have you been doing to work with and through this level of sensitivity to trauma aside from subliminals, and what effects has it had?  Is there any conventional therapy or other type of regimen that has had any benefit for you?

I’m not functioning well, really. I’ve been in a chronic state of dysregulation for a couple of years now and it’s debilitating to say the least. I’m still trying to find what helps but as I’m sure you know, it’s hard to find help, especially when dealing with complex issues that doesn’t fit neatly into conventional mental health models. And this issue isn’t unique to me, a lot of people are struggling with similar autonomic-level dysfunction, even if it’s not very common

This got way longer than I intended it to, I apologize

[London1]

So how are we supposed to overcome guilt shame and fear? Aren't these the things that are responsible for this freeze state in the first place?

If your system has the capacity to move through guilt, shame, and fear without shutting down, then OGSFv3 will probably work just fine if you give it time. But if it continously pushes you into freeze, the issue isn’t resistance, it’s overwhelm. And in my experience, that needs a different approach

What do you think that would be?

[emiebou]

Hi Shannon, if I remember correctly, the usage pattern for UMS v3.1 used to be 1-2-3-4-4-4, but now it’s 1-2-3-4, right? 
And if I wanna restart from stage 1, there’s a 1-month break with no subliminal at all—does that include DRS too?

[London1]

@Shannon
Do you need to.take any break between cycles of ogsf3