Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3

[Smuggler]

Wondering if you can help here Shannon. Last Tuesday night I listened to USLM 3. On Wednesday I got a call about a job i've been trying to apply for. It sounds amazing and is a good opportunity for me. The recruiter said they've already got a team in place (New site opening) but could do with someone of my skills. I sent my CV at 11pm that night. Had a phone call on Thursday morning, arranged an interview for today.

In the meantime, it appears my relationship has gone to absolute shit and is pretty much over, it will take a miracle for me to bring this back. Now she said something interesting, telling me how she felt from Wednesday(the day after I first listened) had changed, it's more or less spiralled the whole week. My 2 days off were Sunday and Monday, I haven't listened again, I don't think I will. Is it possible that this is some kind of resistance effect of the sub? Is there anything I can do to halt/reverse it for now?

Also, I had the interview today. I turned up 30 minutes late, still impressed them enough and was offered the job on the spot.

So you started getting results, and then things lot a little challenging, and you're giving up because of it? I'd say that's all the evidence you need that you NEED that FRM. Keep going.

The first week is the hardest. On the first break, I was fighting with my girlfriend constantly, or trying desperately not to. Then the second week, we are very smooth and things are looking way up.

Keep going. You can't expect to get the results if you run away from the process because it's not always comfortable. Tap out now and all you have to show for it is, "Fear won, and I lost."

Keep going. You may be surprised at how things turn out if you do, I think.

You want to halt it? FINISH WHAT YOU STARTED.

Thanks for the advice, I listened again to USLM3 today. The relationship is now fully over as far as she is concerned. I'm now blocked on everything and am not going to be seeing her around physically at her request.
Does USLM have any potential in reversing this situation? Can I focus attention on it somehow?

[ichigo]

Did the using body fat as energy make it into 3.3? I think I remember talk of it being in 3.2 but you ran out of time?

[4Kingdoms]

Wondering if you can help here Shannon. Last Tuesday night I listened to USLM 3. On Wednesday I got a call about a job i've been trying to apply for. It sounds amazing and is a good opportunity for me. The recruiter said they've already got a team in place (New site opening) but could do with someone of my skills. I sent my CV at 11pm that night. Had a phone call on Thursday morning, arranged an interview for today.

In the meantime, it appears my relationship has gone to absolute shit and is pretty much over, it will take a miracle for me to bring this back. Now she said something interesting, telling me how she felt from Wednesday(the day after I first listened) had changed, it's more or less spiralled the whole week. My 2 days off were Sunday and Monday, I haven't listened again, I don't think I will. Is it possible that this is some kind of resistance effect of the sub? Is there anything I can do to halt/reverse it for now?

Also, I had the interview today. I turned up 30 minutes late, still impressed them enough and was offered the job on the spot.

So you started getting results, and then things lot a little challenging, and you're giving up because of it? I'd say that's all the evidence you need that you NEED that FRM. Keep going.

The first week is the hardest. On the first break, I was fighting with my girlfriend constantly, or trying desperately not to. Then the second week, we are very smooth and things are looking way up.

Keep going. You can't expect to get the results if you run away from the process because it's not always comfortable. Tap out now and all you have to show for it is, "Fear won, and I lost."

Keep going. You may be surprised at how things turn out if you do, I think.

You want to halt it? FINISH WHAT YOU STARTED.

Thanks for the advice, I listened again to USLM3 today. The relationship is now fully over as far as she is concerned. I'm now blocked on everything and am not going to be seeing her around physically at her request.
Does USLM have any potential in reversing this situation? Can I focus attention on it somehow?

One door closes another one opens....

Anytime a relationship ends, it is the worse feeling ever!! You may be beginning a journey by yourself and being in a relationship will hold you back. From time to time, men in relationships remind me in so many ways... "You are so lucky to be single!"

You may end up in a better relationship or have multiple friends with benefits like I do. Take a breather, finish USLM3 and see where it leads you. This may be the luckiest week of your life!!

[ncbeareatingman]

Shannon Wrote:
The need for validation stems from a fear that you are not good enough unless someone else says you are. That too will go away. this was in Matts journal Post.

damn..that in and of itself is sooo friggin incredible...to be free of that 'stuff' ! that would be worth the price of admission,just to clear that stuff outta the way so one's own natural creative flow and flow because it exists not to get validation..what freedom.wow. the world is changing as we are right along with. if this stuff hits you like its hitting me right now... you'd be wow and astounded by it,also..coz it is fuking astounding,when you step back and think about it,look at it. Look at how far we';ve come in 5 yrs. dayummmm!! words dont do it justice. Lookin forward to a compelling future in 2019-2020. Keith

[MasterEnki]

What happens if she buys you dinner / drinks, and/or pays YOU to have sex with her?

And how often does it happens that she pays for everything included your transportation costs and so on? I mean in comparison to the opposite?

Globally, it is around 1% - 2% of women that pay for literally everything (according to what I’ve read).

My last 2 dates paid for everything, except transport. It was the same woman for both dates. Transport was like $2 (two bucks!) via bus (I met her locally at the venue).

I’m aware that this is likely a rare scenario though.


As for paying for sex / ‘sex work’... I am 100% okay with people exchanging money for sex, in a consensual arrangement (which is what the typical escort / prostitution situation is).

Personally, I would NOT pay / hire an escort for myself, unless as a last resort (meaning, if I have zero sex for the next few years, then I will consider escorts an option, IF I can afford it at the time).


Shannon makes a good point, that all dating costs resources (time or energy or money, etc).

Personally, I have a huge problem with men having to pay financially for her (in regular dating / non-prostitution situations). Mostly because I’m stuck in the vicious cycle of poverty / debt.



If I was a millionaire I would likely be happy to pay for everything. But my current financial circumstances prevents that, so I’m screening women out who expect men to pay financially, since I can’t afford it.

Time / energy is a much better option for me, in terms of ‘payment’, since I have a bit of time on weekends, and plenty of energy. But zero disposal income.

Someone else, who is rich / well off, would consider paying money to an escort to be ‘more cost effective’ than the time / energy of dating.

Another quick point, if she (non-prostitute) orders highly expensive things on the date (and expects the man to pay for it all), then an escort could possibly be financially cheaper (cost less money), as well as less time / energy.

[samba99]

That is true Keith,

If the FRM works for real as it suppose to be, then this definitely could be a period of evolution. At least to some of us who use subs

[Benjamin]

Only Shannon can answer that, but as far as the “pay for sex loophole”, I hope that gets seriously addressed because he’s right, one way or another you pay for sex.

There is no "pay for sex loophole".

In that case, how are you going to ensure users don’t pay a hooker for sex but still pay for drinks on a regular date? To me that seems like one and the same thing and I’m sure the subc could interpret paying for drinks in hopes of getting laid as paying for sex.

Is paying for drinks on a regular date sabotaging DMSI to avoid executing it and/or achieving the end goal? A big part of your problem, Sarge, is that you generalize too much with what you believe. You take the "paying for sex" thing too seriously and too literally.

Going out on a date, if your goal is sex, then you will do what is necessary to get to sex. If that means playing into her desires to be wined and dined, then most guys will do that. But in the real world, women aren't just vaginas on legs, and no relationship of any kind is "free". You have to "pay" for friendship, you have to "pay" for love, you have to "pay for sex", you even have to "pay" to masturbate. You're just paying in different ways, and with different things.

Friendship costs time, energy, effort and patience. Sometimes money. Same with love. You wouldn't believe how many hours I have spent taking care of loved ones, both familial and romantic. Sex costs in achieving the state of being who she wants to have sex with (hygiene, gym, socializing, condoms, lube, car, job, fun, etc.), and masturbation requires time, effort, energy, privacy, and for most guys these days, an internet connection and a phone or computer.

DMSI is aimed at preventing you from sabotaging DMSI's goals by wasting time in fantasy, doing useless things, masturbating or ***** a hooker IN ORDER TO PREVENT YOURSELF FROM ACHIEVING THE GOALS OF DMSI. As long as that is not the reason for doing it, or what it will result in, DMSI doesn't care and neither do I.

But you don't deserve a refund on DMSI for buying it and then doing everything in your power to sabotage it, and you don't deserve to blame me for that choice of actions. So my job is to make sure you achieve the goals of DMSI instead of jerking off in a closet because you're scared of real vagina, so I don't have to listen to you guys complain that "DMSI doesn't work" and then have you demand a refund because you chose to jerk off in a closet because you're afraid of real vagina.

Going out on a date and paying for it does not help you sabotage DMSI. On the contrary, it is likely to help you achieve the goals of DMSI. The key here is to prevent self sabotage.

A big part of your problem Shannon is you throw these little tantrums and use me as your punching bag. F*ck off, it was a legitimate question. I’ve been on a ton of dates this week, I’m not hiding in a closet masturbating, take that shit out on someone who is. I don’t know why you have such a problem with me aand I don’t care, I deserve respect as a paying customer. I don’t harass or insult you, I expect the same courtesy.

Because you constantly post stupid crap, and try to give advice to people about women when you're totally clueless, making things worse for impressionable people. There is way too much of that going on right now on the forum from several people. Which is exactly why anyone who has any idea doesn't bother to post or discuss it anymore.

And now you talk to Shannon like this, when I can't comprehend why he botheres to try to explain things to you anymore cos it's always the same response from you. Shannon is less harsh than me, but i'm giving you time off again, i'm sick of it.

[Shannon]

Regarding the anti-hooker-module in DMSI: I don't know how this is worded, but if it prevents paying for sex it could prevent pretty much every sex, because no matter if you pay directly for a hooker or meet someone for a date and hope for sex you still pay for it. So in that certain view it would apply to 100% of women and therefore could have negative effects because in some way you always pay for it.

The modules in DMSI designed to prevent you from turning to paid sex are designed to get you to stop using masturbation, edging, porn, tumblr, hookers, and whatever other ways you guys have to prevent yourselves from achieving the goals of DMSI.

It's not about not paying for sex. It's about NOT ESCAPING AND SABOTAGING YOUR OWN ACHIEVEMENT OF THE GOALS OF DMSI.

I don't give a rat's ass if you pay for sex. I do give a rat's ass if you buy a copy of DMSI, run it, and then go hire a hooker/masturbate to bust a nut/edge/lose yourself to/jerk off to fantasies/whatever so you don't have the energy or drive to execute what DMSI is trying to get you to do. Which is what a lot of you guys were doing before I put that in there, and some of you knuckleheads continue doing regardless.

In other words, what matters is that you are not sabotaging your own achievement of the goals because you're afraid of real vagina. Which is what it basically boils down to. That is the goal of the Wall.

It obviously failed anyway. Which was why I had to keep going, and create the FRM.

I completely understood that you put it in for that reason. I just thought a module which prevents sex if you pay for could cause a loophole because in some ways you always pay for sex. This was my whole point with the comment. And one thing I can tell you from experience, the fear of women/sex/intimacy/[whatever the problem is] was for me definitely stronger than something that could be overcome with such modules, it only creates run-away situations. And I somehow don't even care about these modules anymore but FRM is what is really needed and what will help to achieve the goal, not these modules.

Until I understood how to create the FRM, a lot of other modules were efforts to achieve the goal in different ways. They are still valuable and useful, but now that we have the FRM, the "gate" is being unlocked, and they will actually be taking effect.

Or should be. We shall see if I configured FRM v4 correctly.

The keystone, though, is FRM. Nothing else can work without that in some cases.

[Shannon]

Wondering if you can help here Shannon. Last Tuesday night I listened to USLM 3. On Wednesday I got a call about a job i've been trying to apply for. It sounds amazing and is a good opportunity for me. The recruiter said they've already got a team in place (New site opening) but could do with someone of my skills. I sent my CV at 11pm that night. Had a phone call on Thursday morning, arranged an interview for today.

In the meantime, it appears my relationship has gone to absolute shit and is pretty much over, it will take a miracle for me to bring this back. Now she said something interesting, telling me how she felt from Wednesday(the day after I first listened) had changed, it's more or less spiralled the whole week. My 2 days off were Sunday and Monday, I haven't listened again, I don't think I will. Is it possible that this is some kind of resistance effect of the sub? Is there anything I can do to halt/reverse it for now?

Also, I had the interview today. I turned up 30 minutes late, still impressed them enough and was offered the job on the spot.

So you started getting results, and then things lot a little challenging, and you're giving up because of it? I'd say that's all the evidence you need that you NEED that FRM. Keep going.

The first week is the hardest. On the first break, I was fighting with my girlfriend constantly, or trying desperately not to. Then the second week, we are very smooth and things are looking way up.

Keep going. You can't expect to get the results if you run away from the process because it's not always comfortable. Tap out now and all you have to show for it is, "Fear won, and I lost."

Keep going. You may be surprised at how things turn out if you do, I think.

You want to halt it? FINISH WHAT YOU STARTED.

Thanks for the advice, I listened again to USLM3 today. The relationship is now fully over as far as she is concerned. I'm now blocked on everything and am not going to be seeing her around physically at her request.
Does USLM have any potential in reversing this situation? Can I focus attention on it somehow?

There is always the potential, but my question is, why do you want that so much? Think about it. I know that ending a relationship is painful, but what makes you want it back? What is driving that pain? Is it fear? Is it desperation? Is it neediness? Or is it being heartbroken? I can't answer that for you, but if you answer it for yourself - and do so honestly - you will benefit.

You can use USLM3 to help you get back that relationship, if that were your conscious goal, but I don't know how long it would take or how well it would work.

Also consider the reason for this breakup. You said she told you she felt like something had changed and she didn't like it. Is that your subconscious trying to get you to quit by sabotaging this? Is that he sensing you being significantly afraid and being turned off? Maybe she is afraid that if you have no fears you won't want her anymore. There are a million possible reasons, and unless she articulates them to you in your own language (manspeak), it's unlikely you will figure it out. Emotions are irrational and illogical by nature.

I suggest that you accept what is for now, and let FRM work on you for a few weeks while you heal and deal with some of these fears. Then consider what you want to do with regards to her.

[Shannon]

Did the using body fat as energy make it into 3.3? I think I remember talk of it being in 3.2 but you ran out of time?

Not yet. I will have a look at that and see if it's do-able.

[samba99]

Shannon, I want to make sure of something important, is the second goal of DMSI active in B too? I find it very important to be active in B side because for the user to achieve the first goal he must enhance his mental image (I think you already know how important this is)



From the DMSI page
Goal #2: To support goal #1, we have to develop, enhance and improve your self esteem, self respect, sense of self worth, self liking, self love, self validation, deservingness, self support, self confidence, self image, overcome fear, guilt and shame (yes, it has the entire script of E2’s OGSF and self validation modules in it [V2.0 and later], although it is modified to not disrupt the goals of this program) and so forth. These are the goals that will make you congruent with the effects you get from Goal #1, which is required for maximum success. Now much more heavily, aggressively and specifically focused on the achieving the goals of the program. This goal is only active in 3.2-A.


As you can see it says this is only active in A side. Self enhancement is really important to be active in B side especially with the FRM as it seems we won't be needing A side.


You may ask why I think this is important in B side: because when I executed DMSI B side and had sex (multiple times) with a hot girl, shortly after I lost her mainly because of my self image

[Dilectione]

Shannon, I want to make sure of something important, is the second goal of DMSI active in B too? I find it very important to be active in B side because for the user to achieve the first goal he must enhance his mental image (I think you already know how important this is)



From the DMSI page
Goal #2: To support goal #1, we have to develop, enhance and improve your self esteem, self respect, sense of self worth, self liking, self love, self validation, deservingness, self support, self confidence, self image, overcome fear, guilt and shame (yes, it has the entire script of E2’s OGSF and self validation modules in it [V2.0 and later], although it is modified to not disrupt the goals of this program) and so forth. These are the goals that will make you congruent with the effects you get from Goal #1, which is required for maximum success. Now much more heavily, aggressively and specifically focused on the achieving the goals of the program. This goal is only active in 3.2-A.


As you can see it says this is only active in A side. Self enhancement is really important to be active in B side especially with the FRM as it seems we won't be needing A side.

Great question, I want to know this too because iirc there's only B version for DMSI for 3.3 cs FRM op the HC.

[Shannon]

Shannon, I want to make sure of something important, is the second goal of DMSI active in B too? I find it very important to be active in B side because for the user to achieve the first goal he must enhance his mental image (I think you already know how important this is)



From the DMSI page
Goal #2: To support goal #1, we have to develop, enhance and improve your self esteem, self respect, sense of self worth, self liking, self love, self validation, deservingness, self support, self confidence, self image, overcome fear, guilt and shame (yes, it has the entire script of E2’s OGSF and self validation modules in it [V2.0 and later], although it is modified to not disrupt the goals of this program) and so forth. These are the goals that will make you congruent with the effects you get from Goal #1, which is required for maximum success. Now much more heavily, aggressively and specifically focused on the achieving the goals of the program. This goal is only active in 3.2-A.


As you can see it says this is only active in A side. Self enhancement is really important to be active in B side especially with the FRM as it seems we won't be needing A side.


You may ask why I think this is important in B side: because when I executed DMSI B side and had sex (multiple times) with a hot girl, shortly after I lost her mainly because of my self image

I see I have to adjust that, because parts of Goal #2 are standard in the skeleton script and parts are not. This is only active in Side A refers specifically to OGSF and other parts of the H&C script. The rest mentioned, self esteem, self respect, sense of self worth, self liking, self love, self validation, deservingness, self support, self confidence, self image, is part of the skeleton script, and it is active in both.

The parts that I turn off in B are the parts that can potentially cause bogging down in A, which are OGSF and the parts that specifically try to get you to heal and clear your way through whatever resistance you have to executing. The self esteem, etc. isn't part that gets turned off.

Good catch. I'll change that after breakfast.

[Ryu]

@Shannon
All these things is part of the skeleton script, nice.
Does uslm also have these enhancement ?

self esteem, self respect, sense of self worth, self liking, self love, self validation, deservingness, self support, self confidence, self image, is part of the skeleton script.?