(06-28-2017, 03:04 AM)CatMan Wrote: Hey Chaos, I hear you man, my solution was likely to throw myself into the business world. To take charge of my financial issues, to become the man I always wanted to be, and knew I was capable of. I had initially, on some level likely the attitude of getting the hot girls seeing rich guys with them, and maybe even thoughts of "we'll see if I'm good enough for you NOW bitches!". But, when it was up close and personal, I discovered a lot of that was going on for the wrong reasons and seemed unhealthy and unsatisfying. Be that either the gold diggers themselves, or due to the guy's insecurity about not having all the hot girls around him and how others perceived him with "the image" etc. So that was illuminating. But, like you, I threw myself into something to development myself and become MORE, to rise up through life, so to speak. So...believe me...I hear you. I hear you big time.

Eternity, great post. I am frequently amazed by what people have inside them as well, when they'd look totally "normal". D.Ace, and Ben too, thanks a ton.

And all of you, just know I have zero intention of letting my past define me. If I did, I never would've been crazy enough to listen to a stream everyday to overcome it all, haha! I'm here to better myself, and put the past where it belongs, and become the man I've always knew I was capable of becoming, but got hamstrung by shit. Rest assured, I have zero intention of it defining me, that's why I'm here. That's why we're ALL here!

Now, I accidentally sparked a conversation in RT's journal. I didn't want to derail his journal. I will now post my reply to Shannon's post, I believe he has a few assertions about me unclear, about the girl who caused a big issue for me but is not the only problem, and taking one part of my post and maybe blowing it out of proportion. When in my exact next line in the same post I mentioned how I'm hopeful the sub can aid me in developing that abundance, in BECOMING it, meaning I'm actively going for it and seeking it. And that obviously this will likely be a process, given the extremes of it and my starting point, and that real life results will need to happen to spur it along at some point. I will elaborate now:

It isn't just about that one girl as I've said before, this has been a life time of not getting the sexual access I've craved. So, there's a huge precedent to try to overcome, that is frequently either misunderstood or minimised. I mean, we're talking a total female blackout of anything beyond a hug life long. If it was just ONE girl and one incident as my issue, I likely would've never needed subs, random success here and there would've balanced out the perspective and all would be fine. Maybe it set off a chain reaction of fear, which caused rejections and mistreatment, which created scarcity and resentment/anger, feelings of unworthiness, who knows. Never mind the culture's relentless conditioning of males to become "nice guys", which obviously didn't help my chances with women, which then had to be understood over a long period of time, info had to be sought which was impossible until the last several years online as this phenomenon became more documented, then learned from, others in similar spots to learn from etc. But, the rabbit hole is deeper than just one girl.

I understand the idea of abundance fully, and am wanting to achieve it, that was my point. Internalising it however, while wrestling with a life time of the direct opposite totally contradicting it, before it's reality or any signs of it becoming so, has been the struggle. I don't get how a person can say to themselves "there's no weeds", when the garden is overrun by weeds. If they go in and remove them, which I'm trying to do despite this idea that I'm doing nothing which I don't understand the origin of, and they succeed, THEN they can state "there's no weeds", because they aren't knowingly lying to themselves. So, it can work and be sustained over time.

Even you've said the same thing about ASC 5G, where it wasn't self-sustaining because it didn't deal with issues underneath to support the confidence, only a veneer on the surface of artificial confidence that wasn't permanent or stable over time as a result, and people reported feeling awkward or like they were insincere or not themselves, due to this feeling of duality or "this isn't me" or that it wasn't "real" due to that veneer, so it was getting this natural push back of sorts due to this duality. This is the exact same issue I've mentioned often, so it's weird I get flack for it is all I mean. I thought with that post about ASC that my words would be understood, but maybe communicating over the screen like this things can be lost or misunderstood somehow. But, just know, in a clear way, that those words you stated about ASC 5G's problems, feeling the conflict between where I'm at and where the sub ideally wants to move things, and being such extremes, is the EXACT thing I'm wrestling with here. I mean I catch so much shit for all this...when it seems to boil down to the clearing and healing not going deep enough perhaps. Who's to say this won't be solved with V3.2 even with your talk of increasing the clearing and healing range? Or a later one, my point is we seem to be saying the same kinds of things, but my words get framed as wrong. Or, aside from the clearing and healing not going deep enough, another possibility is this could be as simple an issue of the V1 DRB not being enough to get the job done, but V3 DRB in 3.2 will get me and others in a similar spot, over this feeling of being jammed in between two realities with ease. That's also possible as well.

I don't understand this "face your fears" thing. I'm doing just that, am I not? Listening to the sub, putting myself out there with women often, talking and flirting and meeting new ones as well as legions of existing ones, asking them out etc. I just haven't had positive results to show me things are actually different now yet. I'm not sure what else I'm supposed to do to qualify as "facing my fears", I felt I was doing so already for quite some time. I feel often people can say these vague concepts with no real meaning behind them. I'm far from doing nothing, or *expecting the world to change to me*. You've said that phrasing to Sarge often however...so I assume again you are confusing me with him, which people seem to do, I don't why. I'm simply using and evaluating the program for real life results, just like every other person that has fired it up.

And I have been happy without them for awhile now, and even believing that overall they don't seem to be worth all the time and effort and money I've invested in pursuit of them all the years, as I've written about in my journal often. There's nowhere near the need or interest as before when I started this program or earlier. But, when I write that, I get denigrated as "resisting" or "it's a reversal response", but in this instance you're saying it's a good thing now. Hard to keep up here...the framing of some of my experiences seem to go back and forth, between negative or positive, so it's hard to know if this is progress or not. I feel that since Swisston and I are deemed the "resisters", perceptions of our posts get coloured by that and even if we post something like this about me not caring as much anymore and seemingly not wanting to keep pushing for girls and wondering why or if it's as worth it to me to be so focused on them anymore, if it was anybody else it'd be viewed as progress, but for us "resisters" it's called "resistance" or "reversal response". No wonder both him and I often wonder if the program will ever work over time, you tend to internalise this "I'm broken" mentality, which I saw you post about recently, this thing can become cyclical perhaps. I think the perception over time can colour the updates, one of the reasons I toned down the updates, I wasn't sure if they'd be as useful anymore, and the last thing I wanted is to constantly report no change with girls as that's useless and a pity party nobody wants to read nor me post. In the end, real life results with the program can make all this vanish, we'll see what happens.

Just know, I'm hardly sitting idle, and I WANT to achieve abundance with women to get past all of this forever, but without getting encouragement from reality that I'm moving towards that in even a small way but consistent, it's hard to maintain a new belief in the face of the total opposite. It's like a plant with shallow roots, so to speak. Not quite able to survive on it's own, in spite of everything else around it hostile to it early on.

But what I feel is what I feel about the increased "IDGAF" thing and about me being content now about being single, it's noticeable to me. So I must be on the right path then despite the external vacillations about it being good or bad back and forth.

Still though, at some point, real life results will have to back up the new beliefs in order for them to strengthen. Hopefully in time that can happen. I've been doing, and will continue to, help DMSI along the way. NEVER have I sat and expected it to be a "magic pill" or whatever else. Not once ever. Just so that perception is clear once and for all for anyone reading, as in the past I've tired of that claim I don't know the origin of.

As more and more holes are plugged, hopefully it's a matter of time for us all.

All the best to you all!!

(06-28-2017, 09:13 AM)Shannon Wrote: When you look in the mirror, you don't wait for your reflection to smile before you do. You smile, and your reflection complies by smiling also. It's not "I'm going to believe no weeds into existence when there are no weeds by saying there are no weeds". It's "I now become and make myself the person who experiences a complete lack of weeds." and the weeds will find a way to disappear.

Quote:YOU are what you see being REFLECTED BACK TO YOU by what you perceive as "outside yourself".

When you look in the mirror, you don't wait for your reflection to smile before you do. You smile, and your reflection complies by smiling also.

(06-28-2017, 10:44 AM)apollolux Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 09:13 AM)Shannon Wrote: When you look in the mirror, you don't wait for your reflection to smile before you do. You smile, and your reflection complies by smiling also. It's not "I'm going to believe no weeds into existence when there are no weeds by saying there are no weeds". It's "I now become and make myself the person who experiences a complete lack of weeds." and the weeds will find a way to disappear.

While I personally jive with most of what you're saying, Shannon, I think using weeds as an analogy (which was originally brought up by CatMan) is flawed to begin with. "The weeds will find a way to disappear" assumes the weeds are capable of disappearing without outside intervention, which very many people experience as false. Weeds by their nature multiply without outside intervention, and it is almost always by outside intervention that they disappear.

Quote:"I now become and make myself the person who experiences a complete lack of weeds" is great, but for weeds to disappear one needs to take the appropriate and focused actions towards that end. I personally believe this is why people jump on CatMan - while CatMan is taking some action they (and sometimes I as well) believe he's not doing enough of the appropriate and focused actions towards that end and sometimes have trouble putting into words that sentiment.

Quote:CatMan, I believe you are taking action as you say and very likely others believe that as well, but it's the taking of appropriate and focused actions towards those ends that I and probably others as well are concerned about. Meeting new people and asking women out is fine and I feel is indeed a great direction to go in; it's the other stuff like intentional physical escalation and more sexual conversations and vibe on your end that we're likely suggesting and/or recommending you increase and do more of. This can be done without consciously seeing the abundance beforehand. Do the thing, and if you get a positive response great, and if not be like "ok" and shrug your shoulders and return to the convo with others or whatever you were doing before as if it's "no biggie." This is probably what Shannon means by the following:

Quote:YOU are what you see being REFLECTED BACK TO YOU by what you perceive as "outside yourself".

When you look in the mirror, you don't wait for your reflection to smile before you do. You smile, and your reflection complies by smiling also.