I did start doing 2 hours per day of overcome fear 8 days ago while in the middle of stage 5. Over this past weekend, I met and talked with an attractive blonde for about 2 hours and another attractive blonde introduced herself and her friend one night. Then the next night, I met another blonde and then an African American girl gave me her number. Although it didn't lead to more than that, it was first time in a long time where this amount of action happened in one weekend. Maybe a trickle of light is coming through this tunnel. Don't know for sure if it was result of adding OF, but it was a nice change.
(07-25-2013, 02:19 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Disagree all you want. Of course everyone has different goals, but when you say that you havent had sex in a while its not the sub fault per say. The sub isnt working because you're not allowing it to work. Get yourself infront of more females and get dates.
if you have no females in your life and not enough experience at getting your goal (sex). You need to work on what comes before sex, thats why I recommend WM2.
This is an interesting theory, but I wonder if it's sound. Sex Magnet 2 is supposed to incorporate programming to assist virgins/inexperienced men (like myself) and was one of the reasons I wanted to go straight for it. But if what you say is the case, WM2 would definitely be the better choice.
I pose the question to Shannon:
If a man doesn't have women in his life and wants to be able to go out, meet, make friends with, and have sex with women starting from a place of absolute zero, which would be the better program to run?
SM2, WM2, SM3, AM5/6 etc?
I'm not blaming the sub. If I blamed the sub, I definitely would not be doing reruns of it. I am doing reruns because I still think it can work. If you read what I said, I used the analogy of tunneling through a mountain and my mountain maybe larger than others. Meaning I have to overcome a lot more internally than others. I think you and I are on the same page on that point.
Tackling some of your assumptions, I have plenty of experience. I am out and about meeting women here and there. But the difference in this past weekend was that there was that hint of obvious attraction which I had not seen since AM2011. Maybe I didn't make that point clear which is on me. But this is why I say trickle of light.
Now on the point of choosing between the two products, we obviously view it differently. So, we can agree to disagree, which is cool. That happens.
By the way, masterchief, sorry about using your thread. I just wanted to make a quick observation about my experience along the same lines as your thread to show that there are others who were experiencing something similar. If you decide to do a rerun, let us know how it goes.
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Lets eliminate subs to make this choice easier. Since AM6/SM3 arn't built yet, their out. Since AM5 is the mandatory foundation for WM2 or SM2, its out.
Well I'd rather keep them in since SM3 will most likely have OGSF, and AM 6.0 has OGSF as well. I'm sorry but I think that addition alone will make dramatic changes to the frequency of results reported.
Am 5 can be eliminated, you're right, but let's also look to the future. It may be that neither program "does it all" but a new one like SM3 (with OGSF) would. See what I'm getting at?
As for me, I can't start another sub till sometime in October I believe, so I have to look to the future anyhow.
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Now if you read the product description both products are essentially the same on the SURFACE. The key difference being SM2 is more sexually agressive, and WM2 is more social/flirty, please correct me if I'm wrong.
Now I say "on the surface", just because it says it on the sales page one thing doesn't mean its how you'll be when you finish the set. I'm speaking fro experience, and I know many people on the forum have noticed the same thing. Does it mean the sub is bad? No. It just means its jam packed, and you'll likely not receive the full benefits in one run. Thats why its constantly preached to guys that run AMx subs they'll have to run it 2-3x.
It's jam packed yet...
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Also WM2 is 5G, and SM2 is 4G. WM2 has a sh*t TON more "features" then SM2!
I must admit I'm confused here, which is jammed packed, WM2 or SM2?
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]WM2 is a superior product by far. Until SM3 is released, and there are a couple journals. If sex is the goal WM2 is the way to go.
And now I'm confused again. If sex is the goal, woman magnet is the way to go? How do you figure that?
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not just speaking from assumptions, I'm also basing this off of someone I know who ALSO got zero results from SM2. This isn't the person I'm refering too in post #41, that person ran SM2 twice, and got results the second time. But regardless he's constantly going out and approaching girls, he puts in the numbers. With or without SM2 I'm sure he'd get poon.
Ah yes, very relevant distinction. My own personal situation is not so "numbers friendly", and am definitely looking for a sub that can take me to the social freedom and DESIRE to act on it as well.
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]As for the guy that ran SM2 and got no lays. He then ran WM2 after AM5 and went on to have quite a few lays, and no approach anxiety. He calls it social freedom. I know for a fact my friend on SM2 does not have social freedom. He's comfortable in environments, but he likely still has anxiety.
They may just be different people you know? Can you provide more details? What is the situation with the two guys?
I mean, I might be impressed if a guy putting in the numbers with women gets less results while on SM2 than a guy who had next to no experience with women and did NOT put in the numbers while on WM2. I mean, that would be definitive for sure. But right now, all I'm seeing are two different people having slightly different results.
So again, any details on the level/expertise of these two case studies?
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Everything I've said isn't based off theory, its what I've experienced and seen in real life.
I'm not doubting that anymore, don't worry. My main concern now is if it's the subs or the individual men creating/not creating the results we're talking about.
(07-25-2013, 04:08 PM)SargeMaximus Wrote: [ -> ] (07-25-2013, 02:19 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Disagree all you want. Of course everyone has different goals, but when you say that you havent had sex in a while its not the sub fault per say. The sub isnt working because you're not allowing it to work. Get yourself infront of more females and get dates.
if you have no females in your life and not enough experience at getting your goal (sex). You need to work on what comes before sex, thats why I recommend WM2.
This is an interesting theory, but I wonder if it's sound. Sex Magnet 2 is supposed to incorporate programming to assist virgins/inexperienced men (like myself) and was one of the reasons I wanted to go straight for it. But if what you say is the case, WM2 would definitely be the better choice.
I pose the question to Shannon:
If a man doesn't have women in his life and wants to be able to go out, meet, make friends with, and have sex with women starting from a place of absolute zero, which would be the better program to run?
SM2, WM2, SM3, AM5/6 etc?
I ran AM 5.0, and then followed it with SM 2.0. During that time, and especially during SM 2.0, I went from almost a hermit with social anxiety that prevented me from even going alone to restaurants comfortably to I love going out and socializing.
Did SM 2.0 get me laid? Maybe. I think it's more likely that I spent that time learning to be comfortable socially than getting laid, because you cannot get laid when you don't have women in your life. So I started mastering the most important step to getting laid. And during that time, I did have a woman in my life and we were having sex, but I am not sure if it was SM or not because I happen to know that she was the result of an AYP sub. Although she was pretty sexually aggressive with me in getting things started, but then she wanted me to be the aggressor, and I think SM helped with that.
Probably the best path to take, based on your specific question (starting from absolute zero) is AM > WM > SM. This will give you the growth of AM, the social growth of WM, and then the sexuality of SM.
If you know how to handle women better than absolute zero, SM should be a better choice.
But I think a lot of guys are not getting laid from SM because of two things:
1. Fear, and
2. The filters are set to prevent him from being used for sex, as a measure of preventing him from being mistreated or taken advantage of by women.
For some people, that filter may be preventing them from acting on sexual opportunities. For most of you guys, it seems to be a case of "just too afraid", which will be addressed in SM 3.0.
Not sure which program is better but one thing that I know is true is that you can use a sub to push you in the direction of your goal, but you better have a real life action plan otherwise you ain't going anywhere.
(07-25-2013, 06:31 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ] (07-25-2013, 04:08 PM)SargeMaximus Wrote: [ -> ]This is an interesting theory, but I wonder if it's sound. Sex Magnet 2 is supposed to incorporate programming to assist virgins/inexperienced men (like myself) and was one of the reasons I wanted to go straight for it. But if what you say is the case, WM2 would definitely be the better choice.
I pose the question to Shannon:
If a man doesn't have women in his life and wants to be able to go out, meet, make friends with, and have sex with women starting from a place of absolute zero, which would be the better program to run?
SM2, WM2, SM3, AM5/6 etc?
Lets eliminate subs to make this choice easier. Since AM6/SM3 arn't built yet, their out. Since AM5 is the mandatory foundation for WM2 or SM2, its out.
Now if you read the product description both products are essentially the same on the SURFACE. The key difference being SM2 is more sexually agressive, and WM2 is more social/flirty, please correct me if I'm wrong.
Now I say "on the surface", just because it says it on the sales page one thing doesn't mean its how you'll be when you finish the set. I'm speaking fro experience, and I know many people on the forum have noticed the same thing. Does it mean the sub is bad? No. It just means its jam packed, and you'll likely not receive the full benefits in one run. Thats why its constantly preached to guys that run AMx subs they'll have to run it 2-3x.
Also WM2 is 5G, and SM2 is 4G. WM2 has a sh*t TON more "features" then SM2! WM2 is a superior product by far. Until SM3 is released, and there are a couple journals. If sex is the goal WM2 is the way to go. I'm not just speaking from assumptions, I'm also basing this off of someone I know who ALSO got zero results from SM2. This isn't the person I'm refering too in post #41, that person ran SM2 twice, and got results the second time. But regardless he's constantly going out and approaching girls, he puts in the numbers. With or without SM2 I'm sure he'd get poon.
As for the guy that ran SM2 and got no lays. He then ran WM2 after AM5 and went on to have quite a few lays, and no approach anxiety. He calls it social freedom. I know for a fact my friend on SM2 does not have social freedom. He's comfortable in environments, but he likely still has anxiety.
Everything I've said isn't based off theory, its what I've experienced and seen in real life.
(07-25-2013, 05:30 PM)jamboree Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not blaming the sub. If I blamed the sub, I definitely would not be doing reruns of it. I am doing reruns because I still think it can work.
Why are you expecting hocus pocus results? Stop thinking the sub will work, and work the sub. Take action. Cold approach women like crazy. Work the numbers. You've got something backing you that will support you mentally, yet you go out and "meet" women. The definition of SM2 is to be sexually aggressive, so start being sexually agressive. You SHOULD be touching women when you talk to them. This isn't some BS kino escalation ladder. This is real, if girls let you touch them, your in. If they don't want to be touched move on. BE SEXUALLY AGGRESSIVE. Please don't tell me you are, otherwise you'd have been laid by now.
(07-25-2013, 05:30 PM)jamboree Wrote: [ -> ]Meaning I have to overcome a lot more internally than others. I think you and I are on the same page on that point.
If you think you have a lot more internally to overcome then others, then you do. If you don't think you do, then you don't. If what you're say its true then you should be running OGFS. I think its all in your head. But we won't discuss that, thats for you to "overcome".
(07-25-2013, 05:30 PM)jamboree Wrote: [ -> ]Tackling some of your assumptions, I have plenty of experience. I am out and about meeting women here and there. But the difference in this past weekend was that there was that hint of obvious attraction which I had not seen since AM2011.
I saw attraction in AM11, SM2, & AM5. Not to be arrogent maybe I'm just more attractive, or maybe I just put more effort into my physical appearance. Not something I'll reveal with photos because of my tattoos. Back to my post about being unable to judge you fully online. Looks are important. Maximize what you've got, go to the gym, get good fashion sense. I know a LOT of guys THINK they got this stuff down. THINK they've got attraction.
Stop worrying about superficial unmeasurable things such as attraction, start being sexually aggressive, and getting the results you're looking for.
Dude. Don't worry about me. Your making assumptions about me as to what I'm thinking and what I'm feeling and its starting to freaking piss me off a little. I'm actually in a very good place. I'm not really that worried about whether I get laid or whether I am getting attraction either. I can probably thank the non neediness programming of AM2011 and SM2 for that. I simply gave an observation, which I'm starting to regret. Maybe your assumptions about my thoughts and emotions are based on the title of this thread. Remember, this is not my thread. If what you have is working for you, by all means, more power to you. However, this does not make you my mentor and I don't want you to be. So, move on. I really and absolutely am good.
With that, hope all is well with everyone. :-) And, again, my apologies Masterchief.
(07-25-2013, 10:26 PM)TheGraduate Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure which program is better but one thing that I know is true is that you can use a sub to push you in the direction of your goal, but you better have a real life action plan otherwise you ain't going anywhere.
True, in fact, I'd go a bit farther and say you'd better have a purpose in life beyond the goals of the subs or you will end up analyzing every little detail that happens to you.
"Hmm, that girl looked at me! Must be [insert sub here]"
I've done it, and I think it's the wrong mind-set to have.
Which brings me to:
(07-25-2013, 07:54 PM)ohmygee Wrote: [ -> ]Both subjects only approach girls at clubs.
Guy 1 - Indian, musclar build, dominant/aggresive personality.
Guy 1 did AM11 > SM2 > (no subs for ~6 months) > SM2. Guy 1 always has some sort of substance in his system when at clubs, alcohol, MDMA, phenibut, a combination of the 3. Guy 1 has never been approached when I've been with him. I HATE his style of "game". Goes up to a girl, introduces himself, stays in the ineraction for a few seconds, leaves. He thinks it benefits him by doing so, because if she see's him again she'll be more interested in him, or some stupid mental masturbation along those lines. I'm sure he had a lucky experience that cemented this style of game in him as successful. I dont approve.
He goes clubbing 1-2x a week.
2 girls in his social circle have slept with him but it took them a long time to get him at the right moment before making a move. Lay count unknown.
He still has anxiety even though he probably wouldn't admit it. His life is on hold, all he does is party right now. Honestly, he's my best friend and I'm disappointed with how he's using his time right now. But thats not my decision, so I bite my tongue.
Guy 2 - White, lean athletic build, passive personality.
Guy 2 did AM11 > SM2 > AM5 > WM2. Guy 2 is usually sober. He got laid his first night of WM2 from a girl that approached him. He's constantly approaching, staying in interactions, and escalating.
75% he's had sex at the females house, 25% his house. He's proved to me that logistics arn't as important as I believed. Its still helps a lot though. He goes clubbing 2-3x a week.
He says he has social freedom, and by the amount of girls I think he's slept with. I believe him.
Conclusion, if you have the option do WM2 over SM2.
Sorry man but the conclusion I make here is that Guy 2 has got his shit together, which is why his lay count is higher.
Guy 1 didn't seem interested in improving himself before doing another run of SM2, whereas Guy 2 decided to further improve himself before settling on WM2.
Guy 1 is trying to manipulate girls into sleeping with him (which shows underlying insecurity/doubt), Guy 2 seems more relaxed and comfortable around women.
Now, was that because of WM2? Maybe, but it's all conjecture at this point. I think perhaps the type of guy that uses WM2 is going to get good results whereas the type of guy that uses SM2 is not, and that's just a theory of course.
What was Guy 2 like before WM2?
Guy one is using part of the "double your dating" techniques of picking up women, but he needs to e-mail and get phone numbers so he can ring a couple of days later and invite her to meet him somewhere for a coffee.
There is merit in walking up to lots of women and starting a conversation so that you lose your shyness, but at some point you need to go to the next level if you are serious at getting regular sex.
A woman can feel a bit rejected and wonder what she did wrong, if a guy does not follow through and let her know he would like to see her again.
A lot of women go clubbing, hoping they meet someone who wants a long term friendship. It's up to guy to make it clear that he has enjoyed talking to her, and would like to get to know her better. If she gives him her e-mail and phone number, then usually she wants him to ring her within a week. She will go out with someone else if he doesn't get around to it.
If she does not like him, she may give him a false e-mail address or phone number.
(07-26-2013, 05:57 AM)Joronda Wrote: [ -> ]Guy one is using part of the "double your dating" techniques of picking up women, but he needs to e-mail and get phone numbers so he can ring a couple of days later and invite her to meet him somewhere for a coffee.
There is merit in walking up to lots of women and starting a conversation so that you lose your shyness, but at some point you need to go to the next level if you are serious at getting regular sex.
A woman can feel a bit rejected and wonder what she did wrong, if a guy does not follow through and let her know he would like to see her again.
A lot of women go clubbing, hoping they meet someone who wants a long term friendship. It's up to guy to make it clear that he has enjoyed talking to her, and would like to get to know her better. If she gives him her e-mail and phone number, then usually she wants him to ring her within a week. She will go out with someone else if he doesn't get around to it.
If she does not like him, she may give him a false e-mail address or phone number.
Lol, I guess you're a PUA, am I right?
It's really not that hard to do man. Talk to a girl, continue the conversation, have some fun with it, exchange the info, and off you go. Rinse and repeat.
If you like her, keep seeing her and do what you want, if not, then don't. etc.
The reason I want to be able to talk to women is because once I can, I can do this, and it's gonna be a lot easier. I'll even start having dates and whatnot. But the ability/desire to talk to a woman needs to be there first. For some reason, I get reserved in an almost retreating way when around women. I think about myself, I get self-conscious, and I don't even think about her.
In reality, the way to do it is always focus on her. Ask her about herself, get her talking, make witty comments etc. I've done this before, and women go nuts, but it's always been in a controlled situation that I didn't initiate. My goal is to be able to initiate this WHENEVER I want, WHEREVER I am. It's gonna be awesome.
I think Joronda is a woman dude.
Just curious, is anyone actually going out and trying things? I see a ton of pontification going on but very little write ups about action, what was learned about your actions, and keeping oneself honest as to why or how you might have been avoiding a particular action. In other words, facing oneself.
I just see a lot of sophisticated avoidance techniques.
(07-27-2013, 12:06 AM)TheGraduate Wrote: [ -> ]Just curious, is anyone actually going out and trying things? I see a ton of pontification going on but very little write ups about action, what was learned about your actions, and keeping oneself honest as to why or how you might have been avoiding a particular action. In other words, facing oneself.
I just see a lot of sophisticated avoidance techniques.
So true. I can honestly say I go out and attempt this, but can't do it for mental reasons I'm unsure of. Doesn't stop me from trying tho.