Pimp/ Pick up Artist multistage-...

[SargeMaximus]

I agree with Jake and AfzalG. You can go through life blissfully ignorant and "being yourself" (like me for 25 sexless years) or you can actually make a change.

I find it odd, Ryan, that you say that taking action is lazy but listening to a sub is not. Seems like the opposite would be true.

Also, it's important to note that not all people have come from the same place. From what I read in Ryan's journals, all his problem was he thought he was unattractive. Once that changed, he was fine. Me? I always thought I was attractive, didn't change anything for me at all. All I'm doing is listening to the subs waiting for the supposed "aha! moment", but it isn't happening, so I decided to take matters into my own hands. I don't think this is stupid either, I think it's a good idea.

Anyone successful at anything will tell you that if something isn't working TRY SOMETHING ELSE, and if something IS working, why change it?

[Ryan]

I agree with Jake and AfzalG. You can go through life blissfully ignorant and "being yourself" (like me for 25 sexless years) or you can actually make a change.

I find it odd, Ryan, that you say that taking action is lazy but listening to a sub is not. Seems like the opposite would be true.

Also, it's important to note that not all people have come from the same place. From what I read in Ryan's journals, all his problem was he thought he was unattractive. Once that changed, he was fine. Me? I always thought I was attractive, didn't change anything for me at all. All I'm doing is listening to the subs waiting for the supposed "aha! moment", but it isn't happening, so I decided to take matters into my own hands. I don't think this is stupid either, I think it's a good idea.

Anyone successful at anything will tell you that if something isn't working TRY SOMETHING ELSE, and if something IS working, why change it?

Keep makin' graphs, Sarge, keep makin' graphs

[Dzemoo]

I find it odd, Ryan, that you say that taking action is lazy but listening to a sub is not. Seems like the opposite would be true.

that gave me a laugh

ryan i like some of your posts but you seem to have a problem to accept other opinions, you are hating too much dude



quote from John Alexander - How To Become An Alpha Male (the book shannon recommends reading at least 3 times, in his am instruction)

[Jakeb203]

We need a sub to DO.

SM/WM's target is to change you into a man who is magnetically attractive to women, BUT it does not instructs you to actually ACT.

You can spend ten thousand hours at home, thinking and realizing that you have became magnetically attractive to women, but it does not change the fact that you STILL lack experience with women. In the long term, yes I agree you should become a person who does not seek for too much external stimulation, but the other side of the story, if you look at those who actually got good with women (even if they are not completely attractive to women), it comes from STACKS OF EXPERIENCE. Which comes from years of approaching, seducing, and connecting with women, AND they have made it into a deliberate effort.

I personally have got laid this way. Yes right now I don't need to try too hard to get women if I do want to get laid, but without prior experiences of actually going out, practicing talking and seducing women, I would still be a virgin.

Words to conclude is that : yes, becoming a naturally seductive man is important, and can be many men's end goal, but to actually know HOW to seduce a girl requires intense level of action taking. Every night you go out there, TAKE ACTIONS, debrief on things that you have done wrong, and continously improve your skills with women. It's good to be a magnet who says whatever to get laid because of inner game, BUT taking actions can vastly make results happen faster. That's why we need this sub.

I'm proof and so are many others that what you say is entirely wrong. Dude, I never approached a woman flat out coldly in my life asking her to go out for "coffee" lol nor did it take me anymore than a few months/year to succeed. The sub made girls show interest and I pulled the trigger if I wanted, that's all. And yes I did approach eventually (after women had been pursuing me) but I approached without any mission and women who showed interest (which was a ton of them in most situations). Many guys in the same boat, who never blindly went after women had women approaching/showing significant interest they just didn't understand when to pull the trigger yet. Think you guys just need more work on your tapes. PUA is just a useless way to make you obsess more about women and feel good as a "magic pill" to get laid that is actually 100% a tactic to impersonate a guy who has the mindset of WM & SM. I mean come on you PUA nuts how do you think guys created tactics to pick-up women? That's right... by studying men who naturally get women. So the truth is your PUA subliminal is SM & WM, you guys wanna be lazy and not deal with your own issues to skip ahead to the future which a subliminal can't make you do, sorry. If anything you all are complaining about lack of results because you obsess over it vs. people like me and others who had natural success from the subliminals, didn't.

If you're lacking to get women on it means you're not fully internalizing AM/SM/WM. And if you feel you need "gaming tactics" memorized, you're insecure, lack confidence in your own self, and unattractive to women already.

and pua can be used in relationship very well...because if a girl has fallen in love with you because of pua she will still love you if you continue to be what you were when she met you, the problem is most guys change during relationship ... of course if your knowledge about pua is only superficial and not deep enough you wont be able to hold the girl...

LOL. Sorry but I'm wondering why anyone can take anything this dude said seriously? "Act to be somebody else the rest of your life"? Good luck with that guys. Stick to drawing your graphs in your journals for the next 4 years about how you're chances of getting laid have dropped every month and obsessing over when someone is going to next comment in your journal

Think there should be a separate forum around here for guys who actually want to be better people and have great relationships with women and the other group for guys who are utterly doomed for eternity and ridicule everything this forum stands for (cough) this thread (cough). Just my two cents.

You seem to have misunderstood what the current Pick-up industry is about. AND the fact that you believe what I have said is entirely wrong shows you are ignorant to a degree, as you barely know me, my circumstances, and where my beliefs came from.

Before I educate you on tid-bits what current pick-up industry is all about, I want to say a word about life - what you believe that every good happens from just living and enjoying. YOU WILL NEVER BE TRULY PROGRESSING THIS WAY. Anything in life, despite the luck factor, comes from effort. Business, academics, women wise. Stagnant ways of living life only brings you mediocre results at best. To achieve the sex life you personally want, you need to TAKE ACTIONS. Girls will not start messaging you on dating websites. You need to make it happen. Hotties on the streets will give you attention, but if you don't go up to her, nothing happens. You hesitate, you masturbate. Simple.

Seduction now has become a hobby, AND can be a tool used by many to achieve sexual freedom. If you think that your life is great enough to not pursue any women, kudos to you. But if we were measuring from a seduction ability basis, how many gorgeous women can you truly date/bed? If you show us that you have dated models and 10's from the past, then words you say have the authority. Now don't say that life isn't about dating 10's because that's not written on the AM instruction or it disobeys your life codes. Bullsh8t. Facts do not change. You cannot date/bed 10's or keep her in a relationship, you cannot; You don't have ability to sleep with women on a regular basis, you don't. All the other fancy stuff, like I don't care about sleeping with women, is just mental masturbation. By the end of the day, results is what matters.

I have personally known friends who have slept over 100+ women, and we go out on a regular basis. He gets rejected, some girls do not like him, but he always ends up in bed with them, and it often happens very quickly. Persistence and taking actions guys.

One thing to add is : PUA has evolved in another direction, far like what you have recognized. Negs, push-pull, cold-reading - yes they still use them to a certain degree, but have then placed huge emphasis in another direction - practical theory. Open, transition, vibe, bounce, close. etc. Internalizing this, just like any other sports, makes it infinitely easier to have relationships. Some days you just want to fvck, what to do? Chat up to women. No talking sensitive topics on POFs. Close her in a few words and get a date. Make connections and bring her to your place. That's all. You don't even need to be a magnet sometimes, just don't make any mistakes. You do not know game, you lose the date, REGARDLESS if you care about it or not. Again what I am saying is about results, not about your personal value of dating girl/living life in a certain way.

Back the reality, look at the guys who have got results in the forum. AFZalg. He gets banned because people get in his way too much, thinking that his beliefs are "incorrect", and that he shouldn't go out to "game" women. But guess what - He gets plenty of pussies in the end. His satisfactions come from going out and actually do something about his sex life, instead of sitting on his ass all the thinking and believing that he is the shit and women like him. In other words, he gets fun from laying chicks (as THIS IS what most people want from SM/WM), but NOT from passively waiting for women to come. You can still be a magnet and take actions, it does not infringe on anything.

The moment you think if she likes you or not, you could be sleeping with a few other girls already. Let go of the belief that you should not be taking actions. You are not a flower, nothing comes to you for free.

[SargeMaximus]

Oh I think Ryan might be a flower.

But I agree, nothing comes to you. I had a woman come to my dating profile... only AFTER I had already went to hers. Women approach you in the bar? Cool. Did you have to leave your house to go to this bar? Yesss.

In the end, f*cking right, results are all that matters. And the kind of results matter too. Would you take advice from a guy who beds the kind of girls YOU like or the kind of girls THEY like? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

[Ryan]

And that my friends is why you're all still here debating how to get laid Keep going guys!

[Jakeb203]

And that my friends is why you're all still here debating how to get laid Keep going guys!

[Post in violation of rule 5 and 6]

[Ryan]

And that my friends is why you're all still here debating how to get laid Keep going guys!

We are not debating, we just don't like you

Sorry your post proves otherwise Move on dude.

[Jakeb203]

And that my friends is why you're all still here debating how to get laid Keep going guys!

We are not debating, we just don't like you

Sorry your post proves otherwise Move on dude.

LOL.

[robstar]

We need a sub to DO.

SM/WM's target is to change you into a man who is magnetically attractive to women, BUT it does not instructs you to actually ACT.

You can spend ten thousand hours at home, thinking and realizing that you have became magnetically attractive to women, but it does not change the fact that you STILL lack experience with women. In the long term, yes I agree you should become a person who does not seek for too much external stimulation, but the other side of the story, if you look at those who actually got good with women (even if they are not completely attractive to women), it comes from STACKS OF EXPERIENCE. Which comes from years of approaching, seducing, and connecting with women, AND they have made it into a deliberate effort.

I personally have got laid this way. Yes right now I don't need to try too hard to get women if I do want to get laid, but without prior experiences of actually going out, practicing talking and seducing women, I would still be a virgin.

Words to conclude is that : yes, becoming a naturally seductive man is important, and can be many men's end goal, but to actually know HOW to seduce a girl requires intense level of action taking. Every night you go out there, TAKE ACTIONS, debrief on things that you have done wrong, and continously improve your skills with women. It's good to be a magnet who says whatever to get laid because of inner game, BUT taking actions can vastly make results happen faster. That's why we need this sub.

I'm proof and so are many others that what you say is entirely wrong. Dude, I never approached a woman flat out coldly in my life asking her to go out for "coffee" lol nor did it take me anymore than a few months/year to succeed. The sub made girls show interest and I pulled the trigger if I wanted, that's all. And yes I did approach eventually (after women had been pursuing me) but I approached without any mission and women who showed interest (which was a ton of them in most situations). Many guys in the same boat, who never blindly went after women had women approaching/showing significant interest they just didn't understand when to pull the trigger yet. Think you guys just need more work on your tapes. PUA is just a useless way to make you obsess more about women and feel good as a "magic pill" to get laid that is actually 100% a tactic to impersonate a guy who has the mindset of WM & SM. I mean come on you PUA nuts how do you think guys created tactics to pick-up women? That's right... by studying men who naturally get women. So the truth is your PUA subliminal is SM & WM, you guys wanna be lazy and not deal with your own issues to skip ahead to the future which a subliminal can't make you do, sorry. If anything you all are complaining about lack of results because you obsess over it vs. people like me and others who had natural success from the subliminals, didn't.

If you're lacking to get women on it means you're not fully internalizing AM/SM/WM. And if you feel you need "gaming tactics" memorized, you're insecure, lack confidence in your own self, and unattractive to women already.

and pua can be used in relationship very well...because if a girl has fallen in love with you because of pua she will still love you if you continue to be what you were when she met you, the problem is most guys change during relationship ... of course if your knowledge about pua is only superficial and not deep enough you wont be able to hold the girl...

LOL. Sorry but I'm wondering why anyone can take anything this dude said seriously? "Act to be somebody else the rest of your life"? Good luck with that guys. Stick to drawing your graphs in your journals for the next 4 years about how you're chances of getting laid have dropped every month and obsessing over when someone is going to next comment in your journal

Think there should be a separate forum around here for guys who actually want to be better people and have great relationships with women and the other group for guys who are utterly doomed for eternity and ridicule everything this forum stands for (cough) this thread (cough). Just my two cents.

Ryan do you believe you need to work hard and take action to build a good business? How about something like learning an instrument?
Why is it that you see sex as so different? Sex is an awesome, fun thing to do. Taking action to have more of it in your life is absolutely fine, and doesn't make you "desperate" any more than working hard to make more money, or working hard to learn an instrument.
What makes a guy needy and desperate is seeking women's approval for validation purposes, but if its purely related to sexual desire, there's nothing wrong with it. The more I learn to let go of wanting women's approval, the more I'm in touch with my sex drive and get quality sexual interactions, go figure. But hell I still love sex.

[AlphaRomeo]

lol. This thread is getting ridiculous. PUA guys are "all about action". Magnets are mostly about, well, becoming magnet. The truth is usually somewhere in between, and in this case (in my opinion), closer to magnets.

Yes, you need to take SOME KIND OF action in order to make anything happen, but here´s the thing; PUA guys spend 99 action "units" per day for approaching women, memorizing all kinds of tactics of today etc. and in a good day spend 1 "unit" of action in order to become NATURALLY ATTRACTIVE TO WOMEN DUE THE ACTUAL VALUE THEY HAVE (in other words, what kind of man you are, what are your resources, what kind of life you lead, what VALUE you bring to the table, how self confident you are etc. Memorizing/displaying "clever" tactics is NOT value) Magnets spend about 99 "units" in order to increase their natural value (and not mainly for women but to improve their own life for their own pleasure and satisfaction) and in doing so they naturally attract women and 1 unit for "pulling the trigger". Get it? Magnets DO take action, it just different kind of action that you are blind to and is much more efficient use of energy. Would you rather approach X number of hot women and score Y number of them, or naturally attract the same X number and have them approach you, then pull the trigger for Ys that you actually want (as a nice side benefit from improving YOUR OWN LIFE)?

As I said before, somewhere, women don´t want to be the center of men´s life, they want a man who HAS LIFE! What kind of life you can have if you spend most of your time, energy and resources on chasing them? Dude,become an INTERESTING man who leads an interesting life. PUA is rather far cry from that for most women, at least for high quality ones. And don´t get me even started about AlfaG, or whatever his name was...

[Ryan]

lol. This thread is getting ridiculous. PUA guys are "all about action". Magnets are mostly about, well, becoming magnet. The truth is usually somewhere in between, and in this case (in my opinion), closer to magnets.

Yes, you need to take SOME KIND OF action in order to make anything happen, but here´s the thing; PUA guys spend 99 action "units" per day for approaching women, memorizing all kinds of tactics of today etc. and in a good day spend 1 "unit" of action in order to become NATURALLY ATTRACTIVE TO WOMEN DUE THE ACTUAL VALUE THEY HAVE (in other words, what kind of man you are, what are your resources, what kind of life you lead, what VALUE you bring to the table, how self confident you are etc. Memorizing/displaying "clever" tactics is NOT value) Magnets spend about 99 "units" in order to increase their natural value (and not mainly for women but to improve their own life for their own pleasure and satisfaction) and in doing so they naturally attract women and 1 unit for "pulling the trigger". Get it? Magnets DO take action, it just different kind of action that you are blind to and is much more efficient use of energy. Would you rather approach X number of hot women and score Y number of them, or naturally attract the same X number and have them approach you, then pull the trigger for Ys that you actually want (as a nice side benefit from improving YOUR OWN LIFE)?

As I said before, somewhere, women don´t want to be the center of men´s life, they want a man who HAS LIFE! What kind of life you can have if you spend most of your time, energy and resources on chasing them? Dude,become an INTERESTING man who leads an interesting life. PUA is rather far cry from that for most women, at least for high quality ones. And don´t get me even started about AlfaG, or whatever his name was...

I just find it funny how when I say anything about PUA they all come screaming like little babies, "WHY WOULD YOU SAY NOT APPROACH!". I'm assuming most of you dudes came from some pathetic PUA forum that wanted to pass around Alpha Male as the situation to inner game, right?

Some around here are idiots man (or seriously mentally retarded), literally. When all I'm talking about is living you're fucking life and not having to do things like Alfy whatever his name was

"You will lose a woman if you're not the same person when you met her"

Please dude, that is utter bullshit and comes from a guy who is so insecure that he believes he has to pretend to be someone else to get women. You guys are the same. And by you guys I mean the ones agreeing with a damn thing about what this dude said/suggested. And I'm literally laughing my ass off at you Sarge and Jake who idolize this kind of crap and want more of it around here, especially when you're asking a forum that is against pick-up tactics and more about inner improvement.

Fact of the matter is Alfy dude is probably also suffering about whether a girl texts him back, where to find the next target, what he will do if a girl leaves him and the list goes on. And this guy wants to write crap about how no one should use AM and instead resort to learning game? I'm wondering why any of you that support that idea are here.

I would dub this subliminal "the loser's subliminal"

[Dzemoo]

lol this dude gets hated even if he is not here anymore, i understand why he left


it seems that ryan is seeking validation from the forum and its users so lets give it to him

"ryan you are the man, we are losers..."


afzal perhaps cares if a girl he fucked doesnt write back (you care if a black chick you fcuked says your dick is small ->see your sm2 journal), but you care if some poeple you dont know want to approach because they like it so whats more pathetic

for me it seems that some guys here are jealous of his success so the try to force their theories on others, i mean i dont like all what afzal said/did but he had some pretty decent succes and this speaks louder than words, and ryan all guys here supporting you and your views on this are not getting laid. interesting isnt it?


no one ever said dont enjoy your life, but for some of us watching tv and drinking beer while listening to subs is not what understand under enjoying life, some of us enjoy life when they go to clubs and approach girls and have some crazy shit happening to them...

seriously dude whats your problem? if these guys want such a sub and shannon is willing to build it than let us, care of your own buisness instead of hijacking every thread and insulting poeple you dont know

and funny you always talk about being alpha, for me your behavior is more gamma (caring what alphas do, going against them instead of taking care about his own problems)

[Ryan]

"ryan you are the man, we are losers..."

Thanks Xc, you made me smile