Overblown Hyperbole - DMSI V3.1-A

[SargeMaximus]

I second Chaos's thoughts - I made the jump to B after we had that conversation. I've been on B for 10 days, today will be my 11th, and I already documented my experiences on it.

At some point you need to put the healing aside and just take the leap. B is only focused on the end goal. If after a few weeks of B you don't find it working for you, then I think you can give more concrete feedback on what needs to be improved with DMSI in terms of resistance, which will ultimately help the Maestro make a better product.

I'm looking forward to reading some of the B Side stories from you!

Which conversation? (or are you talking to chaos?)

Taking the leap is exactly what I've been thinking of recently. There's no such thing as "get good, THEN go for it" it's simultaneous and I'm understanding that more now.

I'll start B tonight. Still 2 loops right?

Still 2 loops.

Sorry for the confusion Sarge, I was actually directing the post to CatMan. I posted earlier on his thread how I would take the leap to version B with him.

I ended up taking the leap the next day I think it was, and have been on B since.

I'm looking forward to seeing how B works for you as well, as I've been keeping up with your journal and I definitely notice a massive change in the way you wrote on 2.5 and now.

These are exciting times to be alive...

It's all good man. Glad you've noticed a change, i have too but the naturalizer is really good at making it feel like its me or like i'm reverting back to a way I always was.

Exciting times indeed.

[Catman]

DMSI: 3.1-A, Day 36

Well overdue update.

I'll start from the 23rd, which was my last update, and go until today. That will get you all caught up with me.

Some internal things have occurred that may be worth posting about. Nothing real external yet, sadly. I have been very sick for awhile, this weekend I should be able to go out at last. That's one of the reasons I haven't posted for awhile, nothing to post about which would be of interest to most people. So, Saturday if I go, will be a good chance for seeing progress externally to match any of this internal stuff.

Here we go:

-Seem to be more positive and not so focused on this sub's goals. I'll explain why it doesn't seem to matter as much anymore throughout this post in more detail. I recognise the irony in running a program like this, and communicating about a lack of "NEED" for the end goal. I assume this is a part of the process of actually achieving that goal, not "NEEDING" it. It being "normal", so this contradiction if you will, may have to occur. It's tough to describe due to it being a foreign feeling to me, whether it's that sense of futility, or being non-needy now. Again I've tried to explain a bit more deeper in the post.

-Productivity has kicked up a lot. Procrastination has reduced a lot.

-Junk food and pop taste noticeably different now. Not as good, STILL okay and all...just not as great anymore. Drinking more water, which I never did for a long time, admittedly.

-Annoyingly, on all previous versions of DMSI, I would get random horny fits I called them. And since I had no women around to have sex with, I'd always get those old yearns for porn and masturbation. VERY hard to resist in those circumstances. VERY, as the old urges got supercharged by DMSI and massive horniness. It was awful to go through all of those times, hated it. Finally, thankfully, I can say that somehow, V3.1-A has eradicated any remaining interest in porn. Also, it's eradicated any horny fits. So, I'm not sure what was being triggered to cause that, they seem to be connected then since they're both gone at once now.

-On a similar front, something weird happened. I willingly ended the nofap. I decided I am far past the addiction, and need to now acclimate myself to my penis again and get an idea of size, and condom needs etc. because as of now and due to the nofap I have no idea of my requirements. So I've been "boning up" (lol ...thank you...) on sizes and brands etc. Funny...I kinda "forced" it. I didn't feel the nofap served me anymore, I only started it because the porn-fueled horniness was causing me to do it way more than normal and it started affecting my life. Removing the horny fits and urges for porn seems to have allowed things to go back to a far more natural state. All of this happening at once means they have been clearly connected in my mind, and V3.1-A has done something to all of it.

-Also since ending nofap...the latent horniness which was bothering me and causing issues with maintaining nofap, edging, and looking at pictures of women like actresses and models etc. online a lot which was another annoying habit DIED. All of it. So, for me, it seems all of these things are (were?) connected. I have no "need" for any of it. And the "need" for women plummeted too. I feel at peace now about it all, there isn't that underlying tension and strife, or "trying to hold the beast down" so to speak, like an addict trying to maintain being "clean". Very notable.

-Way back in the day, when I was like 19, I knew a Playboy bunny in my city. At that point, in her prime, EASILY one of the hottest girls I've ever seen. She was a waitress at a place friends and I went to. I was SUPER scared of her, very nervous, I was in much worse shape than I am now, even a few years ago with girls. I recently thought of her, and looked her up on FB, obviously, she's well past her prime now. But still, I wrote her a nice message and added her to FB. She wrote me back, and accepted. I have no intention of having sex with her now or whatever, don't get me wrong. But, maybe something got handled, just by doing that. I thought it was worth mentioning.

-Another girl who is right up there as one of the hottest girls I've ever seen if not THE, and STILL is, contacted me the other night without prodding. She is coming back to town and wants to meet up. I like her, and am attracted obviously, but she stupidly recently had a kid a year ago with an idiot she doesn't speak to now. So..that's quite a bit to take on to be honest and not my scene. Still though, we have a good vibe together, haven't seen her in person for a long time as she's lived in another city for a long time now. We've talked rarely once in awhile through FB or Skype video chat since, her coming back to town soon is notable, but I don't want an instant family, period. I'll update on that over time, regardless as there could be some relevance for DMSI development. I don't have "need" for her or any of it anyway now.

-Daydreams don't count to me...but I've had a few of having sex with girls I know. T, probably my most ideal DMSI target, due to her weekly proximity to me so DMSI can have good time to work on her, and her attractiveness to me, and another girl I know that I find attractive sexually/physically but isn't mentally/emotionally there so I don't think I want any of that fallout and drama with her. Still daydreams anyway, but maybe some a part of me is wanting it and thinking it's possible. So, maybe there's some worth in it. Regardless, the "need" isn't there anymore, so all of this is like on the periphery. It's tough to describe. It's like "it'd be nice...maybe...but it isn't my number one obsession in life anymore" I think might make sense to describe it. I literally haven't felt that sensation before, so it's tough for me to know if it's non-neediness, or that sense of futility I've written about. It's such a foreign feeling to me, it's tough to measure it or gauge it or describe, I think. I know I've often come across as "overinterested" in the past many times, so maybe this is "normal" mode where I'm at now.

-Before I got massively sick, I was out and spent some time with my group. Two girls there haven't seen me for a few weeks, they were all over me very excited and happy and told me they missed me. That could be genuine and not DMSI-fueled, I was gone for two weeks from their sight. T was there, she's the one I'm the most attracted to, the others are hot, but she edges them out. She seems to be continuing this somewhat distant aloof thing. It's tough to talk to her and engage her, she doesn't seem to communicate properly, like small numbers of words as responses. So the conversation feels like a struggle, like I'm trying to KEEP it going. So after a few attempts to engage her, I don't bother, as I don't have the "NEED" to keep trying over and over and getting granules in return, she's being strange. She talks to others, even asks where I've been at times, like when I was gone for two weeks, but didn't come and tell me I heard that from my friend and she didn't come tell me she missed me like the others when she must have to mention me and wonder where I've been. So, it's weird she is so distant (awkward?) when I'm there. She could be perceived as jealous that I talk to other girls too, that has appeared to have happened often. Which is strange for such a hot girl, and I'd talk to her, if she engaged like they do, lol. I told her I wouldn't bite, lmao. Despite giving me little to nothing to work with verbally, she stands and gives me "butt presentations" (beautiful body "but" (lol ;p) her butt is probably her best feature and she knows it) for minutes at a time super close range, within a foot or two when I'm sitting and she's standing. I'm not sure I'm on board with the "butt presentation" thing, as to me, she could be just standing talking to others, as she was. And, given how little she communicates with me, with tiny responses and it feeling a bit forced often, it's tough for me to come out of it with "she must be attracted". The truth is, I'm not sure what the deal is with her, she seems to be a contradiction, with the jealousy and asking where I've been and butt presentations on one hand if you believe in those, and the little to no conversation on the other. I'll probably be seeing her Saturday, it'll have been another two weeks since I've seen her. Lots of snowflakes have dropped into my mind since then, lol. I'll update again on T after.

-Dream of T and I. Her and I talking about our issues communicating and how to get her to open up to me and what she wants and how she feels about me before subs and now and all of the differences. I wish I remembered that one, would've been amazing, lmao.

-Also, I don't reach out to women anymore on this version. I used to send messages etc. about things, follow up and ask how things are going or callbacks to previous convos etc. Now, I don't seem to bother. But, it isn't a "why bother" negative thing, I just don't have the "NEED" to do it, and I'm preoccupied with what I'm doing. I don't reach out and do all of that anymore, no interest and I keep to myself a lot. I answer like when that girl I mentioned above messaged me before she went to bed out of nowhere. But no longer am I hitting them up out of nowhere. I don't even think to do it now.

-Had a dream of T and I in the gym. A guy we know joking with her about being difficult and if she continues doing that she won't get a man. And she said, "You're silly! I'm marrying Andy (name made up by my mind, not a real person) soon, remember?!" And I was shocked, lol. I actually woke up and was still surprised by that, thinking it was real. After several seconds, I realised it was a dream, haha. Weird how she's popping up in dreams so much lately to be honest. I find that happens though on DMSIs. I get these like "phases" where a girl I know really dominates my thoughts for awhile, then things die down and another girl takes her place. I assume clearing and healing is doing this.

-Dream of me picking my cat's hair out of my nose, and it turned into this HUGE hair connected to all this plastic tubing. It was like 10 feet long at the end, LOL. I couldn't believe it, I keep saying "how the HELL was this inside my nose?!!". I guess this is to symbolise clearing/healing, "removing" things etc.

-Other dreams of girls I know. Us hanging out, or one of me palming one of their lovely asses and smacking it and them liking it. I assume clearing, healing and SATT here.

-Dream of being in a mall. I was walking around, and noticed I was the only guy there. And almost all the other people in the mall were my type of female. A bunch working at a juice kiosk in the middle of the walkway we're checking me out and whispering to each other. Felt very unusual, like the guy "wanted" by women, weird feeling. Felt good, but also a bit awkward with all the eyes on me, I guess that proves I'm definitely not used to that phenomenon. So, probably more clearing and healing here and SATT.

-Once again a dream around T amazingly, no idea why she's spamming lol...and another girl I know. We were out at a mall, and they were playing around taking pics for IG I guess. Then we sat down with the other girl's parents and they told us real talk stuff about dating and relationships and men and women. It was solid stuff. Probably more clearing/healing, and SATT.

Okay so, that's about it, lol. There's signs of maybe some internal stuff going on, but to me, the jury still seems to be out for external stuff with girls around me. Maybe more clearing and healing and SATT is needed before that can happen. Or I'm misreading something I don't know. I suppose if that is the case, if DMSI becomes more and more powerful, hopefully it will get to the point it will work on me beyond doubt and will be clear as day.

That's it for now.

[Duke.Togo]

DMSI: 3.1-A, Day 36

Well overdue update.

I'll start from the 23rd, which was my last update, and go until today. That will get you all caught up with me.

Some internal things have occurred that may be worth posting about. Nothing real external yet, sadly. I have been very sick for awhile, this weekend I should be able to go out at last. That's one of the reasons I haven't posted for awhile, nothing to post about which would be of interest to most people. So, Saturday if I go, will be a good chance for seeing progress externally to match any of this internal stuff.

Here we go:

-Seem to be more positive and not so focused on this sub's goals. I'll explain why it doesn't seem to matter as much anymore throughout this post in more detail. I recognise the irony in running a program like this, and communicating about a lack of "NEED" for the end goal. I assume this is a part of the process of actually achieving that goal, not "NEEDING" it. It being "normal", so this contradiction if you will, may have to occur. It's tough to describe due to it being a foreign feeling to me, whether it's that sense of futility, or being non-needy now. Again I've tried to explain a bit more deeper in the post.

-Productivity has kicked up a lot. Procrastination has reduced a lot.

-Junk food and pop taste noticeably different now. Not as good, STILL okay and all...just not as great anymore. Drinking more water, which I never did for a long time, admittedly.

-Annoyingly, on all previous versions of DMSI, I would get random horny fits I called them. And since I had no women around to have sex with, I'd always get those old yearns for porn and masturbation. VERY hard to resist in those circumstances. VERY, as the old urges got supercharged by DMSI and massive horniness. It was awful to go through all of those times, hated it. Finally, thankfully, I can say that somehow, V3.1-A has eradicated any remaining interest in porn. Also, it's eradicated any horny fits. So, I'm not sure what was being triggered to cause that, they seem to be connected then since they're both gone at once now.

-On a similar front, something weird happened. I willingly ended the nofap. I decided I am far past the addiction, and need to now acclimate myself to my penis again and get an idea of size, and condom needs etc. because as of now and due to the nofap I have no idea of my requirements. So I've been "boning up" (lol ...thank you...) on sizes and brands etc. Funny...I kinda "forced" it. I didn't feel the nofap served me anymore, I only started it because the porn-fueled horniness was causing me to do it way more than normal and it started affecting my life. Removing the horny fits and urges for porn seems to have allowed things to go back to a far more natural state. All of this happening at once means they have been clearly connected in my mind, and V3.1-A has done something to all of it.

-Also since ending nofap...the latent horniness which was bothering me and causing issues with maintaining nofap, edging, and looking at pictures of women like actresses and models etc. online a lot which was another annoying habit DIED. All of it. So, for me, it seems all of these things are (were?) connected. I have no "need" for any of it. And the "need" for women plummeted too. I feel at peace now about it all, there isn't that underlying tension and strife, or "trying to hold the beast down" so to speak, like an addict trying to maintain being "clean". Very notable.

-Way back in the day, when I was like 19, I knew a Playboy bunny in my city. At that point, in her prime, EASILY one of the hottest girls I've ever seen. She was a waitress at a place friends and I went to. I was SUPER scared of her, very nervous, I was in much worse shape than I am now, even a few years ago with girls. I recently thought of her, and looked her up on FB, obviously, she's well past her prime now. But still, I wrote her a nice message and added her to FB. She wrote me back, and accepted. I have no intention of having sex with her now or whatever, don't get me wrong. But, maybe something got handled, just by doing that. I thought it was worth mentioning.

-Another girl who is right up there as one of the hottest girls I've ever seen if not THE, and STILL is, contacted me the other night without prodding. She is coming back to town and wants to meet up. I like her, and am attracted obviously, but she stupidly recently had a kid a year ago with an idiot she doesn't speak to now. So..that's quite a bit to take on to be honest and not my scene. Still though, we have a good vibe together, haven't seen her in person for a long time as she's lived in another city for a long time now. We've talked rarely once in awhile through FB or Skype video chat since, her coming back to town soon is notable, but I don't want an instant family, period. I'll update on that over time, regardless as there could be some relevance for DMSI development. I don't have "need" for her or any of it anyway now.

-Daydreams don't count to me...but I've had a few of having sex with girls I know. T, probably my most ideal DMSI target, due to her weekly proximity to me so DMSI can have good time to work on her, and her attractiveness to me, and another girl I know that I find attractive sexually/physically but isn't mentally/emotionally there so I don't think I want any of that fallout and drama with her. Still daydreams anyway, but maybe some a part of me is wanting it and thinking it's possible. So, maybe there's some worth in it. Regardless, the "need" isn't there anymore, so all of this is like on the periphery. It's tough to describe. It's like "it'd be nice...maybe...but it isn't my number one obsession in life anymore" I think might make sense to describe it. I literally haven't felt that sensation before, so it's tough for me to know if it's non-neediness, or that sense of futility I've written about. It's such a foreign feeling to me, it's tough to measure it or gauge it or describe, I think. I know I've often come across as "overinterested" in the past many times, so maybe this is "normal" mode where I'm at now.

-Before I got massively sick, I was out and spent some time with my group. Two girls there haven't seen me for a few weeks, they were all over me very excited and happy and told me they missed me. That could be genuine and not DMSI-fueled, I was gone for two weeks from their sight. T was there, she's the one I'm the most attracted to, the others are hot, but she edges them out. She seems to be continuing this somewhat distant aloof thing. It's tough to talk to her and engage her, she doesn't seem to communicate properly, like small numbers of words as responses. So the conversation feels like a struggle, like I'm trying to KEEP it going. So after a few attempts to engage her, I don't bother, as I don't have the "NEED" to keep trying over and over and getting granules in return, she's being strange. She talks to others, even asks where I've been at times, like when I was gone for two weeks, but didn't come and tell me I heard that from my friend and she didn't come tell me she missed me like the others when she must have to mention me and wonder where I've been. So, it's weird she is so distant (awkward?) when I'm there. She could be perceived as jealous that I talk to other girls too, that has appeared to have happened often. Which is strange for such a hot girl, and I'd talk to her, if she engaged like they do, lol. I told her I wouldn't bite, lmao. Despite giving me little to nothing to work with verbally, she stands and gives me "butt presentations" (beautiful body "but" (lol ;p) her butt is probably her best feature and she knows it) for minutes at a time super close range, within a foot or two when I'm sitting and she's standing. I'm not sure I'm on board with the "butt presentation" thing, as to me, she could be just standing talking to others, as she was. And, given how little she communicates with me, with tiny responses and it feeling a bit forced often, it's tough for me to come out of it with "she must be attracted". The truth is, I'm not sure what the deal is with her, she seems to be a contradiction, with the jealousy and asking where I've been and butt presentations on one hand if you believe in those, and the little to no conversation on the other. I'll probably be seeing her Saturday, it'll have been another two weeks since I've seen her. Lots of snowflakes have dropped into my mind since then, lol. I'll update again on T after.

-Dream of T and I. Her and I talking about our issues communicating and how to get her to open up to me and what she wants and how she feels about me before subs and now and all of the differences. I wish I remembered that one, would've been amazing, lmao.

-Also, I don't reach out to women anymore on this version. I used to send messages etc. about things, follow up and ask how things are going or callbacks to previous convos etc. Now, I don't seem to bother. But, it isn't a "why bother" negative thing, I just don't have the "NEED" to do it, and I'm preoccupied with what I'm doing. I don't reach out and do all of that anymore, no interest and I keep to myself a lot. I answer like when that girl I mentioned above messaged me before she went to bed out of nowhere. But no longer am I hitting them up out of nowhere. I don't even think to do it now.

-Had a dream of T and I in the gym. A guy we know joking with her about being difficult and if she continues doing that she won't get a man. And she said, "You're silly! I'm marrying Andy (name made up by my mind, not a real person) soon, remember?!" And I was shocked, lol. I actually woke up and was still surprised by that, thinking it was real. After several seconds, I realised it was a dream, haha. Weird how she's popping up in dreams so much lately to be honest. I find that happens though on DMSIs. I get these like "phases" where a girl I know really dominates my thoughts for awhile, then things die down and another girl takes her place. I assume clearing and healing is doing this.

-Dream of me picking my cat's hair out of my nose, and it turned into this HUGE hair connected to all this plastic tubing. It was like 10 feet long at the end, LOL. I couldn't believe it, I keep saying "how the HELL was this inside my nose?!!". I guess this is to symbolise clearing/healing, "removing" things etc.

-Other dreams of girls I know. Us hanging out, or one of me palming one of their lovely asses and smacking it and them liking it. I assume clearing, healing and SATT here.

-Dream of being in a mall. I was walking around, and noticed I was the only guy there. And almost all the other people in the mall were my type of female. A bunch working at a juice kiosk in the middle of the walkway we're checking me out and whispering to each other. Felt very unusual, like the guy "wanted" by women, weird feeling. Felt good, but also a bit awkward with all the eyes on me, I guess that proves I'm definitely not used to that phenomenon. So, probably more clearing and healing here and SATT.

-Once again a dream around T amazingly, no idea why she's spamming lol...and another girl I know. We were out at a mall, and they were playing around taking pics for IG I guess. Then we sat down with the other girl's parents and they told us real talk stuff about dating and relationships and men and women. It was solid stuff. Probably more clearing/healing, and SATT.

Okay so, that's about it, lol. There's signs of maybe some internal stuff going on, but to me, the jury still seems to be out for external stuff with girls around me. Maybe more clearing and healing and SATT is needed before that can happen. Or I'm misreading something I don't know. I suppose if that is the case, if DMSI becomes more and more powerful, hopefully it will get to the point it will work on me beyond doubt and will be clear as day.

That's it for now.

I see a lot of changes in you brother, even if you don't recognize it in yourself.

Are you going to give B a shot?

[Catman]

I see a lot of changes in you brother, even if you don't recognize it in yourself.

Are you going to give B a shot?

Hello Duke!

I appreciate that. I guess I'm always looking for the EXTERNAL change, with women, and count THAT as the sub doing something. Tough to consider anything else a win as the external with women is the goal here.

I seem to be getting some stuff going with Version A, so due to my past and issues, it may make sense for me to continue as is for now. I'd like to try to build on whatever is going on, and not over reach.

I've read your journal...man things are heating up for you big time. It's amazing to read, between you and Illumi, it's like you two are listening to a different sub than me, wow, haha. I'm really happy for you, Duke. Maybe someday I can post something similar, seems far off, who knows.

[Duke.Togo]

I see a lot of changes in you brother, even if you don't recognize it in yourself.

Are you going to give B a shot?

Hello Duke!

I appreciate that. I guess I'm always looking for the EXTERNAL change, with women, and count THAT as the sub doing something. Tough to consider anything else a win as the external with women is the goal here.

I seem to be getting some stuff going with Version A, so due to my past and issues, it may make sense for me to continue as is for now. I'd like to try to build on whatever is going on, and not over reach.

I've read your journal...man things are heating up for you big time. It's amazing to read, between you and Illumi, it's like you two are listening to a different sub than me, wow, haha. I'm really happy for you, Duke. Maybe someday I can post something similar, seems far off, who knows.

I think it's the internal changes that ultimately reshape how the world interacts with you. For me personally, all the stuff you're reading is a reflection of how I feel internally. These days, I just look at women as what they are, a dime a dozen commodity.

I don't get worked up about it anymore at all. At the end of the day, a woman can't give me anything that I don't already have internally. It's more like I can give them what they lack. That's how I see it. I think when you start to see things in that way, your external results will align to what you want.

You're getting close brother. I feel it!

[MD81]

Hey CatMan,

I have been reading your journal for quite some time and as Duke mentioned I also think you have made quite a lot of changes recently. I like how you post pretty positive and constructive feedbacks to others journals as well.

What I wanted to ask you is, have you ever really tried to write down in a very detailed and illustrative way how you will be getting laid for the first time? You fantasize a number of girls, have you really thought what has to happen to have sex with them?

Reason I am asking this is from your last post I have an impression that you somehow are lagging the ability to read the hints and cues from the girls who are interested in, or your ability to dig deeper and find the truth if they are really up for having sex? I can relate to this from my experience of having sex the very first time. It was kind of forced by the girl to make me have sex with her. If she wouldn't have done it I probably wouldn't have done it either at that time.

I have seen the same kind of hesitation in girls who are very young or have had very few sexual encounters. They somehow don't know how to push things forward even though they might be really interested in having sex deep down.

I might be wrong, but I think you have a very limited pattern in your mind in terms of things to happen and/or sequence of things before you actually have sex. Maybe a lot of verbal and physical hints from the girl that she is interested, a number of dates, kiss on one date, second base on other and then the final act on the third date. Kind of things we see in the romantic movies. In real life sex can happen within 10 minutes of actually meeting the person for the very first time or it can actually happen in few months. Of course there are lot of variables, including yourself.

Though I have only heard about it - they say if you start writing stories in the most vivid and detailed manner, your mind starts building familiarities in real life as well. Maybe you just want to give it a try as well? I am pretty sure doing this you will really come across a lot of limiting beliefs or thoughts, for example you would be writing a fantasy like "So as I enter this super market, I see this really hot chic right in front of me. And you know that DMSI bubble? Man I experienced it the first time. Time just stopped and it was me and her in that bubble. She keeps staring at me and I keep moving closer to her. And before you know it, I pull her in by my hand on the back of her head and go for a hot passionate kiss. Damn. What I just did? Is she gonna slap me or something. Nope. She looks completely drunk on my sexiness. I take it as a yes sign and take her out of the market back to my car" And imagining all of this your mind is going to start throwing in a lot of if and butts and nots. Well then at least you will have really something to find out talking to others or reading other journals whether such things are possible or not. And then try to internalize those possibilities. Start using them in your stories more and more.

And why just stop there. If you see other possibilities like this girl with a kid who wants to meet you up - just start analyzing that if you go in for sex whats your best way out without getting stuck with a new family? Maybe just use a condom or pull out before you finish. Things might be a lot more simpler than you think CatMan.

[wolverine_i_am]

Congrats on your improvements man. Def can see a major difference.

With regards to track B, why not give it a try? There will always be healing to do. But the thing is we don't need to be fully healed to get results with women. Maybe you might get more attention with B cause it is more focused towards the goal. Just an idea.

[Catman]

Thanks Duke. I'll keep pressing forward we'll see what happens. I guess they need to have something to be attracted TO in order for this to work, so internal stuff seems sensible to be at the forefront to start things off. Maybe in time the rest can follow suit externally to back it all up.

Hi MD81. To be honest, aside from sub-induced daydreams or dreams, I haven't seriously entertained the idea of actually having sex with any of the girls around me. It always seemed like teasing myself, given my starting point and skills with women in reality. Now, I view it as still being a bit difficult to really, fully, conceptualise actually happening, as it is so far removed from my current reality, as Shannon has said before. I suppose in time it may be easier once that changes if DMSI final punches through for me, or perhaps an earlier version. But also, I didn't want to daydream about how it SHOULD or COULD go down, because that may cause disappointment when I or she don't live up to some preconceived fantasy, you know? I want it to be natural, and chill, not a fantasy at all as a man who is desired by women would not need to initiate fantasy about being with women. It's just the norm, you know? Plus, that takes all the pressure and expectation off me and her, so it can just happen how it happens. And yes, I fully understand sex can be immediate, given the right circumstances. Not for me...I've never experienced it, but I know for a fact it's possible for other men to get with women quickly, 100%. I don't think that's something I'd feel comfortable doing so early, but I know it's possible for others. I've had long term issues with rejection and not getting any momentum with girls, so I'm a bit behind on things. But that doesn't mean I'm arrogant and think if it's true for me it is for everyone. I've known a lot of the "bad boy" types that have zero issues with women, even FWB or quick sex within meeting them. Was just something I never was able to do. And on that girl with the kid who is one of, if not THE, hottest girl I've ever seen, I wouldn't want to just have sex with her like that. She's already been treated as Shannon says "a masturbation sleeve" often enough, I don't want to do that. And I don't have such "NEED" anymore, I'm still attracted to her, but it isn't the "Unh! I'm so horny on this sub, I need to bang a hot girl NOW!!!" horny/needy vibe. It's like a quiet, soothing, self-assuredness. So, I'm not sure how to proceed in that situation, if it wasn't for her stupidly getting pregnant, then I probably would've dated her upon her return to my city. Now, it's far more complicated. I don't want an instant family, but I don't want to have sex with her, lead her on like it will become a relationship, only to start a fade out. Feels scummy to me and she's been good to me, so the last thing I'd do is use her like that. I don't seem to really be into some FWB situation with any girl either. I guess I'm using this sub to be able to actually have women attracted to me finally, so I can probably date one. But, I'm not even sure about dating right now, from where I'm at that's a big adjustment too, and also tough to imagine as well because it too has been so far removed from my reality. So maybe the bar for success is currently just simply seeing clear interest with zero doubt from girls I find attractive.

Hi Wolverine! I'll watch how others blaze the trail first. With the unique form of healing and clearing in Version A, and how I seem to be seeing some kind of internal stuff going on, I want to continue to build on that possible momentum. I'll be watching and cheering the Version B Master Race on, lol! Me personally, being long considered one of the "resisters", I may need to stick to Version A awhile and continue to make up ground, even if it's in smaller amounts at a time. I'm just happy with any kind of change to show the sub is doing anything to me, even though I'm not sure if anything external is happening, with T or otherwise. Maybe it is and I'm misinterpreting her awkwardness and limited vocabulary with me, given everything else she's done, but regardless, I think for now clearing and healing with Version A seems to be the best course for me. I don't want to jump prematurely, I want to really build up some solid ground under me first.

[Shannon]

Please do NOT use B side. You're making good progress. Don't interrupt or derail that.

[SilentReader]

CatMan, you DID improved much. I mean. MUCH. Keep going. I believe you'll get result soon.

I know you know best time to switch to B. Follow your intuition. For me, it always the right choice to follow my intuition.

Hope you the best, CatMan. Go. Go. Go.

[Zane]

Catman dont ever delete this thread...IDk why you deleted ur old thread..I use to read it.

[AlphaRomeo]

How´s it going CatMan man?

[Catman]

Hello AlphaRomeo.

Thank you for asking about me.

Things are the same, 47 days of Version A now. Some dreams etc., nothing in real life to back it all up. T is still acting the same, often distant and difficult to talk to for some strange reason compared to before DMSI. It feels usually like a struggle to talk to her and like I'm forcing the interaction, so I don't and the interactions are short and surface level, pretty hard for anything to happen then. Which is frustrating because before DMSI, she was amazing. Now it's so weird how she is, it's been a massive downgrade, she was my #1 target, so this kind of situation as a result of using DMSI is annoying to say the least, it's been a reversal of results, figures. The other girls are good, but the same as before. Nothing stands out as a clear positive signal of something happening or different since starting. I read some updates and wonder if we're listening to the same sub.

I still can't tell if I've simply just finally given up on the girl thing ever happening, and just tuning them out now. Or if I've just given up on the sub ever working, or if it's the sub causing the detached IDGAF I've felt for a long time now. I still have no idea. I figure if it was the sub causing it, then it would be doing something in reality as well by now, and that hasn't been the case, so I lean to one of the others. It still seems far fetched for it to work too, it still seems to be out of my "current reality". Not sure when it ever will be in my reality, it still seems over the top.

I haven't really had a need to update with anything, and don't like updating like this as I find it starts things I have no interest in, so I haven't. Basically, I'm still waiting for that one instance where a girl does something I can honestly say she wouldn't have done before, proving it's finally working.

Thanks again for asking about me, I appreciate it. I hope all is well with you.

[ReeZoX]

The IDGAF I would say definitely is caused by DMSI.

The reason why T may be this way is because she senses changes within you. Changes she's not necessarily comfortable with. She gets uncomfortable because she doesn't know how to handle "the changed you".

And I would like to say that, just because you don't notice everything, doesn't mean things aren't happening. I don't know your story or anything of it. But I personally, was very bad with finding out if women liked me. Because they didn't say it

Later on, I figured that women don't say it, not with words. Out of EVERYTHING I've consumed related to seduction/pua or any of the kind, the thing that has made the most difference for me is the ability to read body language. Small and subtle signs that for most men, wouldn't mean a thing. But for me, now I do know their signs of interest. Small things women do to get attention from a man. But us men are generally so damn bad at readings these signs. This has been golden for me with interactions with women, but also good when acting as a wingman for my friends.

So could it be possible that women do show signs of interest towards you, but you don't "catch up on them"?