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+--- Thread: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear (/Thread-Revisiting-guilt-shame-and-fear)
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 04-12-2014
(04-11-2014, 09:24 PM)SargeMaximus Wrote:(04-11-2014, 05:57 PM)mat422 Wrote: I don't really understand what you're getting at here. Elaborate if you want to.
Well think about it, where are you right now?
Well like you said, I'm sitting in a chair inside of my house replying to this message.
But beyond that I'm not sure what you want me to think about.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - SargeMaximus - 04-12-2014
(04-12-2014, 12:53 PM)mat422 Wrote: Well like you said, I'm sitting in a chair inside of my house replying to this message.
But beyond that I'm not sure what you want me to think about.
Not much, actually. Just feel where you are, and be THERE.
Additionally, ask yourself these questions frequently:
- Where am I?
- What am I doing RIGHT NOW?
- What's going on inside me?
- What action can I take RIGHT NOW to further my goals?
All else is pointless.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 04-13-2014
(04-12-2014, 06:09 PM)SargeMaximus Wrote:(04-12-2014, 12:53 PM)mat422 Wrote: Well like you said, I'm sitting in a chair inside of my house replying to this message.
But beyond that I'm not sure what you want me to think about.
Not much, actually. Just feel where you are, and be THERE.
Additionally, ask yourself these questions frequently:
- Where am I?
- What am I doing RIGHT NOW?
- What's going on inside me?
- What action can I take RIGHT NOW to further my goals?
All else is pointless.
I'll keep those in mind, thanks. Not sure about all else being pointless though. I don't really like boxing my thoughts in, but that's just me.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - SargeMaximus - 04-14-2014
(04-13-2014, 06:30 PM)mat422 Wrote: I'll keep those in mind, thanks. Not sure about all else being pointless though. I don't really like boxing my thoughts in, but that's just me.
Boxing your thoughts in?
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - Adri - 04-14-2014
(04-12-2014, 06:09 PM)SargeMaximus Wrote:(04-12-2014, 12:53 PM)mat422 Wrote: Well like you said, I'm sitting in a chair inside of my house replying to this message.
But beyond that I'm not sure what you want me to think about.
Not much, actually. Just feel where you are, and be THERE.
Additionally, ask yourself these questions frequently:
- Where am I?
- What am I doing RIGHT NOW?
- What's going on inside me?
- What action can I take RIGHT NOW to further my goals?
All else is pointless.
Those questions are powerful! I just wrote them, I think I will keep them at a place I can see them all the time!
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 04-14-2014
(04-14-2014, 03:10 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote:(04-13-2014, 06:30 PM)mat422 Wrote: I'll keep those in mind, thanks. Not sure about all else being pointless though. I don't really like boxing my thoughts in, but that's just me.
Boxing your thoughts in?
Yeah everyone's minds work differently. The way you phrased those thoughts made it seem like they were the 4 most important things and to disregard everything else. I can't do that.
My brain works like a web. I make a huge number of connections to things in day to day life and then process what's useful for me using my intuition. Hard to explain because it's not something that can be put into words very easily.
Cognitive functions if you're interested
Basically you're wired a certain way and it's easier to go with that than try to learn a completely new way of processing things.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 04-29-2014
Been a while since I've posted. I've noticed that I've let go of a good amount of shame over the problems I've been facing. Opened up to more people about my issues and stopped being so secretive of everything. So things have turned around for me in that I no longer beat myself up so much and make things worse. Instead I see the problem as something I can overcome somehow, I just don't know the way yet.
I was debating whether or not I should go on antidepressants to treat my chronic depression. I was seriously considering it for a while because I was running out of options. But today I decided I'm going to look into some kind of alternative medicine doctor that can put me on a regimen of vitamins and supplements. If that doesn't work I'll try the antidepressants, but I really think there's some physiological reason for this and it's not all mental.
Which I've realized that my mind tends to look for ways how to get out of the depression, but the fact is I've struggled with this for years and I've realized that going inside my head is the worst thing to do. There's a tendency for me to believe if I just meditate more or find out what's wrong I'll overcome it, which isn't the case. So now I'm just focusing on enjoying my life as much as possible and not getting caught up in analyzing my beliefs and whatever. Until I fix the depression it's going to stay there, so I might as well try to make the best of things and put my energy into other stuff rather than fighting with it so much.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 05-07-2014
Always trying to fit a mold, that's been the majority of my life. Always trying to stay somewhat in the middle avoiding any conflict. Most of the time because I was so sensitive and carried the weight of others opinions more heavily than my own sense of self. It got to the point where I had no real sense of self because I'd assume I was always wrong and others knew better than me.
But it's gotten to a point where I just don't care anymore. There are so many ignorant people running around thinking they're the greatest person ever, meanwhile they ruin friendships, hurt people, and slack off in life. And here I am, being so hard on myself that I miss out on opportunities in my life. For whatever reason I've always thought of myself as a bad person, but compared to other people out there I'm practically a saint. I honestly don't know where that comes from. Negative beliefs? Maybe. It could also be because of the chronic depression I've experienced in my life that has intertwined with my personality. And I don't know if that's a genetic thing or not. It doesn't really matter, so long as I handle it.
I recently realized after talking to some of my friends that we're all struggling in our own ways. And it made me feel better because I didn't feel like I was this messed up individual and everyone else had everything going well. It just put into perspective that it wasn't me. It's the world around me and my friends pick up on it too.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 05-30-2014
So I'd thought I touch on a few things that I feel like the EPRH sub has touched on. First one is, opportunities. It's weird, but my life feels like it's in complete chaos but I'm fortunate enough to have opportunities pop up that help me out. Looking back it kind of feels like a weird kind of safety net thing. No matter how badly I'm screwing up, it's like there's always something that can help me out. For example, I recently went out to California for about a week to visit a friend. I feel like this sub really pushed me to make that journey in order to grow because I've never traveled that far in my life. I live in NY, so it was cool checking out the west coast. It wasn't a life altering experience, but I feel like it helped me out a bit. But the trip cost me money and I was worried about my savings running low. It just so happened a short job opportunity watching some dogs for a week popped up and that covered my travel expenses. Little things like that where it works out are always welcome.
Now for the problem area with self growth and subs in general. I realized that I do have issues with getting better with regards to my depression and anxiety. I think part of this is I don't have a memory of not being this way, so it's hard for me to understand what an improved version of myself would be like. So far in the past my main way of combating this was the fake it till you make it attitude. Which doesn't work. And worst of all I lost sense of who I was as a person because I was just covering it up. Also I managed to get really good at surface level relationships where people liked my persona, but as soon as they wanted to get to know me more I'd withdraw because I was terrified of them seeing the real me. And I still suck at that, I'll consistently find myself taking on that persona and then realizing I'm not being authentic. But to be fair, I think it stems from that anxiety and the fight or flight response, it triggers a kind of acutely aware paranoid state where I'm analyzing people and preparing to defend myself. And there is A LOT of projection going on, to the point where my mind starts weaving these interpretations that aren't even close to the reality of the situation.
With that being said, I have this deep gut level feeling of nausea or something when I think of running a sub. And I think it stems from the fact that I want to change, but I'm having trouble and every perceived failure is my fault. It's like a real slap in the face when I run a sub for a good 3 months or something and still find myself battling with the same issues I faced years ago. It just feels like I'll always be battling with this and never find relief and that's a horrible feeling. Mostly because life goes on and I have to deal with it, but every day that passes it just all feels so wrong and I just know something is wrong.
This comic sums up how I feel a lot of the time
I've also realized I tend to suppress those feelings a lot which leads to a numb state where I don't feel the bad feelings as much, but the good is also muted. Lately I've been breaking out of that. Part of the problem is years of the same recurring problem and no way to express that to people. Mostly because when I do it turns into a list of shoulds and people thinking they understand when they don't. So instead of getting support it just turns into this guilt and shame ridden state where I feel worse because I shouldn't be feeling that way and it's negative. So I guess I really have to work on opening myself up to whatever it is I'm feeling, but at the same time not get carried away into a negative thinking loop.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - Fonzy3 - 05-30-2014
Yeah I can see where you're coming from in regards to that comic. I'm not sure if you notice too many positive effects from these subs but what really helped me was to let go of my current mindstate and thinking try to completely flip it around. Go against what you think is right and just have the program do it's thing. Lose all self serving thoughts and just allow your mind to be open. This is just temporary. You might feel like you've lost yourself or feel exposed for a few minutes but I guarantee it helps with any resistance you might have and you can feel the comfort in knowing that the program is helping you in all areas of your life.
Thanks
Fonzy
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - SargeMaximus - 05-31-2014
If I were you, I'd read the comments for that comic.
Seems like a LOT of people see the comic the same way you do.
Here's a secret: EVERYONE is f*cking depressed, ALL the time. I recently realized that it's always the people who act like their life is the greatest who you find out are miserable bastards, while people like me, are just miserable all the time. Heck, I feel like I'm 2 steps away from suicide most days. But if you can DWELL on that feeling, really accept it, there's an amazing power.
The strength to be weak.
You're not flawed, you're human.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - swisston - 05-31-2014
I am not depressed and my life is pretty amazing
There's plenty I want to change, but I am very rarely unhappy.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - Natious - 05-31-2014
Absolutely enjoyed reading your journals, my thought processing is similar in a way and even if I'm not in a perfect place right now I can tell you one thing. Don't believe everything that people say, if someone says something that a huge population follows doesn't make it any more true.
There are people that are not depressed and you can overcome depression. I haven't read Shannon's full story but he had been depressed for a long time and now he seems to be doing rather well. I have overcome depression in a house full of depressed people and although I have somewhat fallen down back to that hole I know for certain that I can get out of it.
When people sell me some sort of their version of the life's truth I do consider it and take what I can, but thank god I stopped taking it so literally all the time. You said you have tried getting out of the depression multiple times but somehow came back to some problems consistently, maybe you never had the right tools, maybe that or that or that. What you believe is your freedom of choice, just choose the beliefs that help you keep your faith in yourself and your growth.
RE: Revisiting guilt, shame, and fear - mat422 - 06-03-2014
(05-30-2014, 01:21 PM)Fonzy3 Wrote: Yeah I can see where you're coming from in regards to that comic. I'm not sure if you notice too many positive effects from these subs but what really helped me was to let go of my current mindstate and thinking try to completely flip it around. Go against what you think is right and just have the program do it's thing. Lose all self serving thoughts and just allow your mind to be open. This is just temporary. You might feel like you've lost yourself or feel exposed for a few minutes but I guarantee it helps with any resistance you might have and you can feel the comfort in knowing that the program is helping you in all areas of your life.
Thanks
Fonzy
I definitely notice positive effects, so I'm thankful for that. That's usually the approach I try to take. It can be difficult though when I get stuck, these days I try to stay out of my head as much as possible. I realized letting go and trying to let go are two completely separate things.
(05-31-2014, 04:51 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: If I were you, I'd read the comments for that comic.
Seems like a LOT of people see the comic the same way you do.
Here's a secret: EVERYONE is f*cking depressed, ALL the time. I recently realized that it's always the people who act like their life is the greatest who you find out are miserable bastards, while people like me, are just miserable all the time. Heck, I feel like I'm 2 steps away from suicide most days. But if you can DWELL on that feeling, really accept it, there's an amazing power.
The strength to be weak.
You're not flawed, you're human.
Well I think it's more likely that depressed individuals looked for the comic and that's what I'm seeing in the comments. There are a lot of depressed individuals, but it's not everyone. And then there's depressed and clinical depression, people tend to mix those up.
I don't know about dwelling on the feeling. That's actually been something I've had to train out of myself. If by acceptance you mean acknowledging it's there and to just keep moving forward, I agree with you.
You might be interested in this documentary. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1613092/
They say 50% of your happiness is genetic. I know it's hard to imagine but some people really are happy, for no reason whatsoever. The idea that EVERYONE is depressed is a huge generalization. I used to think like you. But I was experiencing a lot of cognitive dissonance. It was easier for me to believe that everyone was miserable than accept the fact that some people really aren't. That's hard to come to terms with, especially if you've lived most of your life with depression. And on top of that if you are depressed your interpretation of events are very skewed and you may project onto other people. You may see more misery than there actually is.
It's a comforting thought knowing other people are miserable, but it's not true. Misery loves company.
(05-31-2014, 09:58 AM)Natious Wrote: Absolutely enjoyed reading your journals, my thought processing is similar in a way and even if I'm not in a perfect place right now I can tell you one thing. Don't believe everything that people say, if someone says something that a huge population follows doesn't make it any more true.
There are people that are not depressed and you can overcome depression. I haven't read Shannon's full story but he had been depressed for a long time and now he seems to be doing rather well. I have overcome depression in a house full of depressed people and although I have somewhat fallen down back to that hole I know for certain that I can get out of it.
When people sell me some sort of their version of the life's truth I do consider it and take what I can, but thank god I stopped taking it so literally all the time. You said you have tried getting out of the depression multiple times but somehow came back to some problems consistently, maybe you never had the right tools, maybe that or that or that. What you believe is your freedom of choice, just choose the beliefs that help you keep your faith in yourself and your growth.
Thanks. That's definitely a life lesson I've learned over the years, I think that comes with self confidence and realizing my opinions are just as valid as anyone else
My long term goal is to beat depression, but I've also accepted that might not be a possibility. As long as I can manage it and pursue the things I want in life I'll be ok.
Yeah. I just recently got on anti-depressants, which have always been my last resort. But I've read they have really turned some people's lives around. And I figured it's about time to try something different. Worst case scenario if I don't like how they make me feel and I ween myself off of them. But I've got to at least try.