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+--- Thread: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 (/Thread-Smoking-sub-take-3-HST-take-1)
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Shannon - 11-27-2012
(11-27-2012, 11:41 AM)Elusive Wrote:(11-27-2012, 10:39 AM)Shannon Wrote: What do you mean, Elusive?I do admit, that I could have expressed myself better and more clearly.
Now I wonder that it might be perceived in ways I did not intend.
What I meant was that, I really enjoy reading about Patti's journey and your advice/feedback, Shannon. Just wanted to express myself some. I maybe should remain silent when I'm tired, so I don't write confusing stuff.
With a mind like mine, I have frequently to request disambiguation, as I see many possible ways a given thing can be understood, interpreted or perhaps misunderstood.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-02-2012
Sean, I do know that but it’s just that I was really hoping that it wouldn’t feel like an everyday choice I’d have to make. I'm afraid that if that feeling doesn't go away, I'll start smoking again. What I'm trying to do is keep focusing on is what Shannon says about being fine by the end of the program. I’m only in the middle now, so there’s a ways to go and much time to hope.
Elusive, I actually heard that as you meant it, and thanks. I’m guessing people read my thread but don’t feel the need to comment, or possibly (if not a smoker) don’t understand what I’m going through. All is fine with me. There’s many times that I read the guys threads and am either strongly in agreement or sometimes strongly in disagreement but don’t really feel it’s appropriate to comment as I’m not a guy in their situation lol.
Shannon, you know I’m hanging on your every word! Lol My problem has always been the psychological aspect of smoking, as opposed to the nicotine addiction part. Hopefully by the end of the program, I won’t have to make the day to day choice to not smoke. But for now, as long as I’m choosing not to smoke, it’s working.
I don’t know if I agree about the commercials, because they sure did seem scary to me! I was thinking maybe they effected me that way because I’m listening to this program. Maybe looking at visuals would help the program to work even better.
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Today, I’m posting with a very heavy heart. We’ve had an issue with our youngest daughter for a long while now. Before we left for Florida, there was a plan in place for her to go to a day to day place to get some extensive help that she needs. She’s wasn’t working and unemployment extended her claim, and the insurance company would pay for the therapy. It was a plan and good one. But when we got back, she said she had gotten a job and was not going to get help. Said she was fine and could handle it herself. She actually has multiple issue, one causing the rest so to speak. We’ve coddled her and gotten 2 therapist to help in the past, nothing that ever helped and she’s not even close to being strong enough to handle this. So this time we opted for tough love. I told that since she opted to not go through with getting help, then after the holidays she needed to find another place to live, as we couldn’t watch her kill herself anymore. Being impulsive and immature she left yesterday, and is living with her boyfriend and his family. This is killing me, because they are not equipped to deal with her issues and I’m not even sure they know she has any. She’s very convincing about being fine or actually anything else she wants someone to believe. I had even started her listening to the overcome guilt, fear and shame sub, but she didn’t have enough listening time to make any positive difference.
The only reason I’m posting this, other than maybe the therapeutic effects of getting it out (I haven’t talked to anyone other than my immediate family, as to not embarrass her, although with it being the holiday season with family functions, it’s gonna be hard to be hard to be silent) is because even going through this horrible time, I haven’t smoked and I thought that was worthy to post. Believe me, I have wanted to but choose not to.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Sean - 12-02-2012
Patti,
I'm so proud of you! You're being so strong through a difficult situation, choosing not to smoke and handling the disappointments of your daughter. It can be hard to love someone who is self-destructive, but you're doing the best you can.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Magnus - 12-02-2012
Patti as a smoker I understand how hard it is to give up. I also know for me its hard to get other non smokers to understand the physcological side of things. I remember a while back you saying how smoking was like a friend to you and that reminated with me. I remember when I gave up for a few months years back and it was that comfort and familiarity that drew me back in during a rough period.
You are doing great managing to stay smokefree through a difficult time as I know all to well how easy it is to slip back into it and if you can stay off it during the difficult times the easy times will be so much easier.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-04-2012
Thanks guys! I happy that I haven't turned to smoking but I'll be happier when it's off my mind completely, it that ever happens.
I'm finally on stage 4! Hopefully that will help even more.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Shannon - 12-04-2012
I find it fascinating that of all the people who have used this sub and reported back, Patti, you are the only one who comes to mind for having this difficulty letting go of smoking. Everyone else who uses the sub properly just simply forgets to smoke and in fact it is difficult to get them to see why they should continue to use the program after that. They shift into being a nonsmoker without effort, and their biggest risk is that they will quit using the program before they're finished with it because they don't see the point. (I don't intend this to sound snide or condescending, I really do find it fascinating.)
But the program is designed to work for everyone, including those who fall into the extremes of difficulty. We have gotten you to choose not to smoke. Now let's see what the program does about shifting to the identity of a non-smoker. It may be that all of this, at this point, is residual response to resistance which won't even exist when you finish the program and the input stops.
Jimbobday, as I have said before, earlier in this very thread (or maybe the one before it from Patti), if the majority of people who use this program to quit do so effortlessly, then smoking is a psychological issue vastly more than a physical addiction issue, and the issue is based on what amounts to negative brainwashing. You hear everyone say how hard it is to quit... and you see "experts" saying how hard it is to quit... and you experience friends and other smokers having a hard time... well if you take all of this as being "how it is", then you've basically allowed yourself to be brainwashed into believing that "it's hard to quit smoking, and I should expect to fail and have to suffer and try again and again and fail anyway".
In other words, you create a subconscious program that leads to the very things everyone says is true, which makes it true for you, because you're running that program... and that only makes it stronger when you act it out. It's self hypnosis on top of brainwashing at that point. Then others see your result, and they do the same thing, and it becomes a self perpetuating thing based on accepted belief, not reality.
Once again, compare it to cutting a loaf of bread. If you tried to cut a loaf of bread into slices but used a hammer, would it work? Of course not, and it would seem impossible to boot. Same for a screwdriver, or a bubble level, or a nail gun. But pull out a sharp serrated knife, and suddenly it's easy. It's all about using the right tool for the job, or in this case, the right approach for the person. Sure, it seems preposterous to try to cut a loaf of bread with a hammer, because you know a hammer isn't designed to cut bread. And guess what? It's just as preposterous to try to quit smoking by doing almost everything people try to do to quit smoking these days. Nicotine replacement therapy? Come on. Nobody ever quit using a drug because they got more of it. You can't wean off nicotine because every dose completely re-sets the physical addiction. Which only takes about 14 days to break, by the way, and after that you see the psychological impact. So really the difficulty in quitting smoking is in overcoming the belief that it must be difficult to quit. And whether I am a smoker or not has nothing to do with these truths.
If smoking was so hard to quit as everyone seems to think, my program would not work at all, for anyone. But as it turns out, the vast majority of people quit so easily that they think they did it themselves, and don't give the program any credit. Why would they report their success? They don't think the subliminal did it. And then one person who struggles posts, and the point of view seems to be that "it doesn't work, it's hard to quit, smoking cessation is a real struggle". When the truth is, for about 97% of the people who have used the program properly and reported back to me about their experience have quit so easily they didn't think the program did it. The other 3% of people are - you ready for this? - Patti. Patti is the exception to the rule, not the rule as it appears to be.
The issue, as far as I can tell, stems entirely from a deep terror that Patti (and doubtless others like her) seems to hold that being a non-smoker is somehow be worth being terrified over. This also seems to be the issue with the only other person I know who might be as resistant as Patti is, who so far has not succeeded in using the program properly past Stage 1.
It's not hard to quit smoking. That's obviously debunked by all the people who succeed so easily. You just never hear from them because for them quitting is so easy they take it for granted, and don't even always credit the program for their success when I ask them privately what happened, never mind having them keep a journal. As if smokers typically "just forget to smoke".
What's hard to do for a very small percent of the population, it seems, is let go of the unreasonable fear that acts as the root for the outward manifestation that is smoking.
Patti, if by the end of the time you use this program you are still struggling, we will find a new approach that will include fear destruction. But we can't know if this one will work until we finish it.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-05-2012
I find it fascinating that of all the people who have used this sub and reported back, Patti, you are the only one who comes to mind for having this difficulty letting go of smoking. Everyone else who uses the sub properly just simply forgets to smoke and in fact it is difficult to get them to see why they should continue to use the program after that. They shift into being a nonsmoker without effort, and their biggest risk is that they will quit using the program before they're finished with it because they don't see the point.
I think I’m on a different level than others that have used your program. I believe myself to be more with the group of people that we’ve both encountered whom don’t wish to stop, really. What I have seen in most of my experience of successful quit smokers, is it’s usually the first try. Those of us that struggle have made it more of a trial and error type of situation, with the failures writing our history as well as much of our future. It would be interesting for me to know of the quitters you mentioned, how many times they’ve tried to quit, how much they’ve smoked and for how long. I think it all makes a difference and may possibly be why it’s harder for one person more than another. Another point, is that it’s been with me for every single emotion that I’ve encountered. It’s similar to being married for a very long time and then not. There’s an incompleteness that I feel.
I think the hardest part is the psychological part. I compare it to being an alcoholic. They never stop being an alcoholic, they just don’t drink. I may always be a smoker, that just doesn’t smoke.
I don’t want you think I’m struggling to the point of giving in yet, because I’m not. My acknowledged fear at this point, is that what I feel, feels very familiar. It just feels like I’m taking a break. I think that was something I told myself to get through other times that I had stopped. I think the program at this point is giving me the will power to choose not to smoke. Right now, because of the deep sadness of my situation with my daughter, it’s a little harder than it has been. But it’s probably the first really sad time I’ve experienced since I stopped smoking. My guess is these feelings may come up whenever an old/new emotion comes into play.
I feel that I’m about 75% rid of my need to smoke, but only half way through the program. I still have 3 stages, and that’s a lot of stages. My other hope is that, like the other subs I’ve used, this one will ruminate more and more in my subconscious after I stop using it. I may just be the type of person who will need to listen to stage 7 every six months or so, who knows? I hope not and I will be using the fear sub in the future, so that may help with this cause also.
And you’re right, quitting smoking isn’t hard. It’s dealing with the thoughts about it, that for me, never seem to go away, that is what's hard.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Shannon - 12-05-2012
Quote:I think I’m on a different level than others that have used your program. I believe myself to be more with the group of people that we’ve both encountered whom don’t wish to stop, really. What I have seen in most of my experience of successful quit smokers, is it’s usually the first try. Those of us that struggle have made it more of a trial and error type of situation, with the failures writing our history as well as much of our future. It would be interesting for me to know of the quitters you mentioned, how many times they’ve tried to quit, how much they’ve smoked and for how long. I think it all makes a difference and may possibly be why it’s harder for one person more than another. Another point, is that it’s been with me for every single emotion that I’ve encountered. It’s similar to being married for a very long time and then not. There’s an incompleteness that I feel.
I would not say "on a different level". I would say "with a different point of view". The only differences between your type and the other type are that you are resistant to change, and you have associated smoking with somehow being whole, complete, safe, good enough, etc. In other words, at the deepest level, you have more fear than the average smoker, and you associate smoking with relief in some way.
These others did not stop their first time. Using my program was not the first time any of them tried to quit smoking, to the best of my knowledge and recollection. I will try to get some of them to post here for you. But you know my mother spent 20+ years trying to quit. I believe that at the least, every one of the successful users had tried to quit at least twice before using my program.
Quote:I think the hardest part is the psychological part. I compare it to being an alcoholic. They never stop being an alcoholic, they just don’t drink. I may always be a smoker, that just doesn’t smoke.
Having two "alcoholics" in my family, having observed many more in long term settings, and having had the feedback I have had from people using my Stop Drinking Alcohol program, I can tell you that I firmly believe that "alcoholism" is not a disease. It is a response to fear or stress, given by certain personality types and levels of personal maturity, which can be mitigated by either facing or overcoming that fear or stress and growing past the response of turning to alcohol. I believe, after all I have seen, that "alcoholism" is no different than smoking. It can be overcome, and permanently. It does not mean that person is always an alcoholic. It means they have subconscious programming that results in a cycle of actions which is called alcoholism, and that programming can be changed.
My mother was an active alcoholic for decades, and when I was 11 she attended her first AA meeting. That was the last time she ever drank alcohol in excess, but not the last time she ever drank alcohol. She did have some of my home brew beer once, about 20 years later, to taste it. Now, according to conventional wisdom, that would have resulted in her drinking the rest of the glass and then going into my room and pouring herself another and another until she was passed out again. She did not. The difference? Through AA, she acknowledged her issue, and then faced her fears and overcame them. From then on, she neither had nor wanted alcohol anymore. Even after I grew up and moved away. Even when she had wine in the house for cooking - and not all of it was salted wine, either. (By the way, she was attending AA meetings for I believe 5 years after quitting, and then she stopped and never went back. As she was no longer an alcoholic, it was unnecessary for her.)
She is not the only "alcoholic" I ever saw do that. I have had reports of people doing the same thing in response to my subliminal. And the difference between these people and the poor slobs who would come into the AA meetings with head hung low in shame and say they "fell off the wagon" week after week? The "poor slobs" were stuck in a cycle of fear and escapism. It was easier to stay drunk than to face the responsibilities of the sober world that scared them so much.
AA saved my mother's life, and as a result, probably saved my life as well, but they are not without their faults. Their MO is to week after week perpetuate the belief that "I am an alcoholic". And what makes an alcoholic an alcoholic? Drinking too much alcohol, of course! So in essence, out of simple ignorance, AA is unintentionally perpetuating alcoholism in at least some of these people by programming into their heads that they are alcoholics and they always will be. Well, a literal subconscious is going to say, "Oh, I'm alcoholic and always will be? Okay, let's fulfill this role then. Where's the rum?"
I think it's flat out bullshit to say that alcoholism is a disease, because that's an excuse and a cop out. It's also bullshit to say "once an alcoholic, always an alcoholic", because drinking alcohol is a choice. It might sometimes be a subconscious choice... but it's always a choice, and one that can be changed if the "alcoholic" decides they are in enough pain, have done enough damage, cares enough about themselves or others, decides to grow up and face their fears and stresses, or any of a number of other situations.
If alcoholism was a disease that could not be escaped, it would not be possible to overcome it.
The same is true of smoking. It is the faulty beliefs of society at large concerning these things that makes them what they appear to be.
There is no such thing as an alcoholic who does not drink alcohol, and there is no such thing as a smoker who does not smoke cigarettes. If you have not outgrown the weakness that results in turning to alcohol as your coping mechanism to stress and fear, you are an alcoholic. The minute you have outgrown it, you are not an alcoholic, because at that point, you will never have an alcoholic response again.
The same is true of cigarettes. A smoker thinks they need to smoke. A smoker thinks they want to smoke. A smoker is willing to smoke. But no non-smoker thinks any of these things are true. And to truly be free of cigarettes, you must break the physical addiction AND the psychological issue, which is "I identify as a smoker. I believe I need and want to smoke. I believe it has to be difficult to quit smoking. I am afraid to be a non-smoker."
Once you become a non-smoker - and you will - you will no longer believe you need to smoke, or believe you want to smoke, and you will look back and wonder... "Why did I make it so unnecessarily hard to quit?" Mark my words.
Quote:I don’t want you think I’m struggling to the point of giving in yet, because I’m not. My acknowledged fear at this point, is that what I feel, feels very familiar. It just feels like I’m taking a break. I think that was something I told myself to get through other times that I had stopped. I think the program at this point is giving me the will power to choose not to smoke. Right now, because of the deep sadness of my situation with my daughter, it’s a little harder than it has been. But it’s probably the first really sad time I’ve experienced since I stopped smoking. My guess is these feelings may come up whenever an old/new emotion comes into play.
This is an attempt by your subconscious to sabotage your current success in having stopped smoking my saying, "Okay, I can't stop from quitting, this program has done that... but we can always just say we're taking a break, and keep going later."
Look at yourself. You have stopped smoking. You ave been without a cigarette for how long? And through a stressful and difficult situation emotionally? The ONLY thing holding you back now is the fear of letting go and accepting yourself as a non-smoker.
Quote:I feel that I’m about 75% rid of my need to smoke, but only half way through the program. I still have 3 stages, and that’s a lot of stages. My other hope is that, like the other subs I’ve used, this one will ruminate more and more in my subconscious after I stop using it. I may just be the type of person who will need to listen to stage 7 every six months or so, who knows? I hope not and I will be using the fear sub in the future, so that may help with this cause also.
Telling that you say you feel that you are 75% rid of your need to smoke. Look at the revelations within that sentence.
First, you FEEL it, which means it is coming from your emotions, not your mind, where logic resides. You don't "know" it, you "feel" it. You have given yourself away as having a strong emotional component to your personality by saying that, which fits your reason for resisting - fear. An irrational emotion.
Second, you referred to it as "my need to smoke". Only smokers believe they need to smoke. Do I need to smoke, or believe that I do? Not in the slightest. I am a non-smoker. So this says you still believe the lie that you need to smoke, even though you are long past your actual addiction to nicotine. In other words, you are only running on fear based brainwashing now.
You don't need to smoke. Nobody needs to smoke. If that were true, you'd be born with a cigarette for an organ, don't you think? You need to breathe. You need to eat. You need to dress warmly in the winter. You need to drink enough water. Needs are the things that keep you alive. If it doesn't keep you alive, it's not a need, no matter how much capitalism and advertising might have you believing otherwise.
So let's re-phrase this properly, shall we? You have a part of you (not all of you) that wants to smoke because it is irrationally afraid not to. And so far, about 75% of the desire to smoke has been removed. There we go, much better. Much more accurate.
If we can make this program do it's job fully, experience says that you will never need Stage 7.
Quote:And you’re right, quitting smoking isn’t hard. It’s dealing with the thoughts about it, that for me, never seem to go away, that is what's hard.
Breaking the physical addiction isn't hard. What's hard is letting go of fears which perpetuate the belief that smoking is somehow normal, necessary, beneficial and desirable. And you know what? As with any fear... the fear that drives smoking is exactly as hard to destroy as you make it. Which is why most people have an effortless time quitting with my program and Patti struggles. Because Patti is afraid to be unafraid. Fear is Patti's "devil she knows".
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-06-2012
I think “relief” is the best possible descriptive word that could be applied to me and my addiction.
Some of the definitions of relief are:
Freeing of somebody from anxiety: a release from anxiety or tension, or the feeling of release, lightness, and cheerfulness that accompanies this….Yes
Factor that ends anxiety: a factor that ends a painful or stressful experience such as pain, hunger, or boredom…Yes
Stark contrast creating diversion: a factor forming a contrast to the general character of something else, especially something that breaks the monotony or tension of a longer experience…Yes
These all define reasons as to why I smoke or smoked. Is there anything in this sub that addresses relief?
I think your mother was very brave and lucky drinking alcohol after knowing and addressing she was alcoholic. I know many a recovering alcoholic who cannot even use mouthwash because of the small alcohol content. In the same respect I wish I could be the type of person who could smoke on occasion of only when I really enjoyed it, but that’s impossible and not the way addiction works, or at least for me.
I do feel that fear plays a big part in all addiction and I know it’s your go to reason of choice with most difficulties that people have when trying to change in some way. But isn’t it possible that perhaps the 75% percent of the addiction that is gone, is basically just the addiction part, whether it be physical or psychological? Couldn’t it simply be that the 25% that’s left is just the liking and enjoyment that I got out of smoking? Does it always have to be a fear issue? You’re right, I don’t need to smoke, I do want to. But sometimes not because I’m afraid to not be able to but just because I like to. It does the same for me as maybe it does for someone who has a glass of wine after a long day. And if it’s true that 25% is just about me liking it, I suppose that will just have to diminish in time. I suppose you will turn me liking it around into that being my fear also. But I don’t think everything is always about fear.
In any case, I hope to lose both the fear and the enjoyment of smoking with this sub because I don't want to do anymore quit smoking subs after this. Either it's gonna work or it's not.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Shannon - 12-06-2012
Quote:I think “relief” is the best possible descriptive word that could be applied to me and my addiction.
You are holding on to and trying to own "your addiction". Let it go, Patti. "Your addiction" ended about 14 days after you quit smoking. It's not there anymore. You cannot hold onto what does not exist, and trying to is a sign of fear.
Quote:Some of the definitions of relief are:
Freeing of somebody from anxiety: a release from anxiety or tension, or the feeling of release, lightness, and cheerfulness that accompanies this….Yes
Factor that ends anxiety: a factor that ends a painful or stressful experience such as pain, hunger, or boredom…Yes
Stark contrast creating diversion: a factor forming a contrast to the general character of something else, especially something that breaks the monotony or tension of a longer experience…Yes
Anxiety is a form of FEAR. Stark contrast creating a diversion is dealing with boredom.
Quote:These all define reasons as to why I smoke or smoked. Is there anything in this sub that addresses relief?
Quite, indeed.
Quote:I think your mother was very brave and lucky drinking alcohol after knowing and addressing she was alcoholic. I know many a recovering alcoholic who cannot even use mouthwash because of the small alcohol content. In the same respect I wish I could be the type of person who could smoke on occasion of only when I really enjoyed it, but that’s impossible and not the way addiction works, or at least for me.
Patti, when you watch someone who was an out of control alcoholic for 20+ years drink a couple mouthfuls of beer and then nonchalantly hand it back and then move on to the next topic as if nothing happened, you know that luck had nothing to do with it. You either have the desire for it or you don't.
She didn't. She was no longer an alcoholic. And she's not the only person I have seen do this. I also know people who find a balance with alcoholism that allows them to drag their lives through the mud for decades and think they are happy with the result. But the only thing going on is that they've found the "misery they can deal with". Those people, and the ones who haven't yet achieved that balance, are going to be the alcoholics.
Again... there are only three observed states when it comes to alcoholism. State 1 is active alcoholic. State 2 is inactive alcoholic (trying to stop drinking, what you are calling a "recovering alcoholic" I think). State 3 is non-alcoholic. Most people do not achieve state 3 because they are continually brainwashed by AA into believing they have no hope of getting past alcoholism, and they never actually address the root of the issue, which is growing past the fear that drives this response. I firmly believe that alcoholism is a response, and a choice, not a disease and not an addiction. You may have a genetic propensity to have a somewhat different physical response to alcohol than others. But it's a choice, and trying to say it isn't only enables those people to suffer more because it is a ready made excuse as well. "Oh, I can't help myself, I have no power to change, I'm helpless, this is never going to be different, I will always be an alcoholic and always have to suffer the temptation of alcohol.
Bullshit. And bullshit on the same logic applied to smoking. It's a choice, and you have proved that in quite clear demonstration.
I have an "alcoholic parent". Do you know why I never "became an alcoholic"? Because I was so terrified of alcohol that it set me straight. While all the other kids were experimenting with it, I wouldn't touch it. While the other kids were partying and discovering alcohol as a way to socialize with social anxiety, I wouldn't touch it. It's the same thing as alcoholism in reverse: subconsciously, I had a program running that prevents me from drinking to excess. Out of fear.
When I overcame that fear, I found that I could drink alcohol and even get rip roaring drunk and not want to drink in an addictive manner, except once with one particular type of red wine. That I had what I recognize as an addiction response to. But I never drank any of that again, because I recognized that response, and I CHOSE to prevent it. I also recognize that an addiction response can be a subconscious response, and not just a genetic one.
The only thing preventing you from succeeding is this belief: "I wish I could be the type of person who could smoke on occasion of only when I really enjoyed it, but that’s impossible and not the way addiction works, or at least for me."
This is a false argument because your nicotine addiction ended at day 14. The rest is a psychological response to fear you feel that you are not good enough by yourself, and that without a cigarette, or nicotine, you are somehow therefore insufficient and incomplete. This all boils down, in your case, to fear based self esteem issues. You think you need a cigarette to be "complete" and "good enough".
You are choosing to continue to crave cigarettes because you have this fear. Because the fear still says, "But without cigarettes, I'm not good enough. I'm not good enough by myself. They're what makes me whole, complete, good enough, and not alone in the world."
You have chosen to cooperate to the degree that you are no longer smoking. Now you have to choose to outgrow the limiting belief that you are not good enough as a person, or somehow are alone in the world, without a tube of shredded plant leaf and chemicals that you would otherwise unnaturally inhale the smoke of.
This that you're telling me is quite simply a subconscious resistance point, and a cop out. Let go of the idea that you're addicted, Patti. You're not. Let go of the idea that you are helpless. You're not. Let go of the idea that you're the exception to the rule - you're not. Let go of the idea that you have to suffer. You don't.
All of those are choices you ARE MAKING RIGHT NOW based on fear.
Quote:I do feel that fear plays a big part in all addiction and I know it’s your go to reason of choice with most difficulties that people have when trying to change in some way. But isn’t it possible that perhaps the 75% percent of the addiction that is gone, is basically just the addiction part, whether it be physical or psychological? Couldn’t it simply be that the 25% that’s left is just the liking and enjoyment that I got out of smoking? Does it always have to be a fear issue? You’re right, I don’t need to smoke, I do want to. But sometimes not because I’m afraid to not be able to but just because I like to. It does the same for me as maybe it does for someone who has a glass of wine after a long day. And if it’s true that 25% is just about me liking it, I suppose that will just have to diminish in time. I suppose you will turn me liking it around into that being my fear also. But I don’t think everything is always about fear.
Fear isn't my go to reason of choice. Fear is the reason I keep cornering in my explorations, experimentation and research. Over and over again, when I look down the rabbit hole deeply enough, I eventually find fear, hiding there in the deepest corner. So it's not as if this is just a convenient reason, or an easy excuse. This is what I have found to be the root cause, over and over.
You are now up against the wall, and you are starting to respond like a frightened animal. You're trying to rationalize this into becoming a reason for continuing to smoke, and this is also coming from fear, because that part of you that is so afraid to let go of smoking is now realizing that it is inevitably going to lose. It must face this fear and overcome it, if you keep going. And it does not want to. You wanted so badly to quit that you got this par, and now you seem to be acting more and more like the mouthpiece of your fears as we get closer and closer to absolute success.
You are asking me, "Isn't it possible that what's left is my enjoyment of smoking?" I think it is preposterous to believe that you ever actually enjoyed smoking. It takes a certain level of brainwashing to make a person believe that something as unnatural as intentionally inhaling smoke is something rational, reasonable, normal and natural to do. That's why you coughed at first. Your body was rejecting it.
How preposterous, then, to think you enjoyed performing this unnatural act that you were performing to deliver insecticide to your body.
And once you have let go of the addiction, you're finding that the only thing between you and actually becoming a non-smoker is your choice to let go of these fears, and that scares you, because it means you have to face the fact that you feel insufficient without them. You have convinced yourself that you need them to continue. To be complete, "good enough".
I think I see the reason your previous efforts failed in the past now, Patti. You can stop the act of smoking, but until you change the root of the issue, the subconscious will slowly and tirelessly work to continue the cycle, and it restarts you by making you forget why you quit, and all the things you were sick of and replacing them with this bullshit about you still being addicted, needing them, enjoying them, being helpless, etc. etc. It won in the end because you had nothing countering it in the past. And that is why you will succeed this time.
Quote:In any case, I hope to lose both the fear and the enjoyment of smoking with this sub because I don't want to do anymore quit smoking subs after this. Either it's gonna work or it's not.
I can certainly understand that sentiment. Fighting a hard battle is not easy. But you have to understand that ultimately, Patti, the fight is between you and you. You just haven't figured out, yet, how to let go. Ultimately, the issue is that you have to choose to let it go. Face the issue. Outgrow the cop out.
Last night, while trying to get people for you to talk to about their experiences, I talked to one of my testers who just finished the set in the store. She was one of the resistant personalities. She quit smoking at about week 8, and all cravings disappeared for her about 3 weeks before the end of the program. I asked her if she was a non-smoker. Her reply was "I say I am." And that's exactly the right response. SHE says she is... and that is what makes it so. Just like you say you're not, and that makes it so. Argue for your limitations, and they are yours.
I'm working on getting her and another successful non-smoker I have current access to, to come here and talk with you and post her experiences.
I'd also like you to go back and re-read all your stop smoking journals.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - ssh - 12-06-2012
Quote:In any case, I hope to lose both the fear and the enjoyment of smoking with this sub because I don't want to do anymore quit smoking subs after this. Either it's gonna work or it's not.
Well, I didn't want to jump into this thread as Shannon has addressed everything, but as he has mentioned in the past in this thread, Patti is close to win. It's always darkest before the dawn. If Patti becomes successful in overcoming this last stretch (and I believe she will) She will be free for ever. Patti, the elephant has passed out, it's just the tail that is left. Let go off the tail and you win.....
Patti, I think your subconscious is giving you excuses by saying that you will loose the 'enjoyment' (so called, when the truth is, it's NOT, it's totally false). Shannon, an addictive person, let it be any addiction, whenever he/she performs the act of addiction it leaves (a so called, enjoyment response) false response in the subconscious (like enjoyment etc.). The subconscious doesn't differentiate this 'enjoyment' and it's source (good or bad) and with every attempt this piles up and when someone tries to remove this base of false response registered, it tries to relate this enjoyment with the addiction there is a void created which the person feels needs to be filled and the only way he/she feels could be achieved is through the addiction only. But this void could also be filled with something genuine and harmless.
Patti, engage yourself in some healthful and harmless activities and try to fill in this void, keep yourself busy. Take off your mind from the fear and consequences of quitting and start focusing and believing as a non-smoker (even I don't like this word too) a normal person. You are giving your energy to the negative responses like fear or other excuses, no, just focus on the positive ones and imagine a normal you, free for ever.... That's where you need to focus your energy.
I think Shannon has definitely addressed this in his program. Fear and the false response creating void needs to be addressed which I believe is included in this program.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-16-2012
Thanks for all the words of wisdom and encouragement! All are heard and appreciated.
What I’m noticing the most now, is how smoking numbs emotions and honestly I miss that. I’ve been quite angry and frustrated at certain situations around me and it’s really hard dealing with emotions that I don’t think I’ve ever totally dealt with before. I think smoking takes off layers of anger, frustration, sadness or whatever emotion is happening. I think right now, this is the hardest part of not smoking for me.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Shannon - 12-16-2012
So you're saying that because you've been numbed by smoking for so long, you don't know how to deal with these emotions? Learning how to deal with them may be a challenge, but I guarantee you, it's worth it, both for the smoking and for your overall emotional health.
RE: Smoking sub-take 3-HST-take 1 - Patti - 12-17-2012
Yep, that’s pretty much what I’m saying. I’m sure you’re right, but it can be very over-whelming to constantly feel an onslaught of feeling and emotions. They just seem to sit in the pit of my stomach. I just try to breathe them away as best I can.
Because of how hard this has been, I’m planning on using a sub after this that’s a little lighter and hopefully slighter easier. I was thinking of gratitude. Are you planning on updating that any time in the near future?