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+--- Thread: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 (/Thread-Shannon-s-Journal-Discussion-Volume-3)
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RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - thor2014 - 07-12-2018
Sarge food for thought are you going to learn another tactic to pull an hb 8.5 and yet another tactic to pull porn stars ?. Its nonsense i do not believe the push and tactic was what got you the hb 6.5.
I bet she just found you attractive from the start and you never had to run push and pull on her.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - Theron - 07-12-2018
@Shannon
Not sure if this has already been requested. before you create AM7, could you also create a Wealth sub so we can get into the affordability zone before AM7 is released.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - SargeMaximus - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 06:51 AM)thor2014 Wrote: Sarge food for thought are you going to learn another tactic to pull an hb 8.5 and yet another tactic to pull porn stars ?. Its nonsense i do not believe the push and tactic was what got you the hb 6.5.
I bet she just found you attractive from the start and you never had to run push and pull on her.
You're entitled to your opinion thor, but I disagree. And since I have experience with the 6.5 and you do not, you would be wise to defer to me in this instance.
Now, this is all a bunch of close-minded nonsense on your guys part. If talking to regular people about subliminals I'd expect the same kinds of arguments. You guys are completely ignoring my experiences and the points I have made.
Zane is correct in that I'm kind of an exception in a lot of ways. Maybe I'm just good at finding loopholes others can't find.
I remember in sales yesterday I went to an area with my cousin (we both work for the same company. We used to work for one, now we work for another). The benefit here was that we could visit the same areas we did for the last company if we just visited the houses the other guy had already done.
My cousin told me about one house and how he had to listen to this old guy ramble on and on about shit before getting the sale. My cousin was like "You might not think it's worth it, just so you're warned"
I smirked because I have a different belief than him.
I went to that house (last one of the night) and got the sale without any conversation on the guy's part. I simply had the vibe of "if you buy from me, I'll listen to you, but only then." and sure enough, after he bought, we had a nice little chat.
Different paradigms, different methods, same result, but I like mine better.
I'm a bit different than most guys and PUA.
When I began my PUA journey, a life coach scooped me up and "rescued" me from PUA. Claiming I didn't need it to succeed with women. That I could learn to be the most authentic, natural, and best version of myself and women would come naturally (this is exactly what you guys are trying to tell me).
Well I took him up on his offer, and after a year and a half of his "coaching" I realized that it was NOT working.
Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - lano1106 - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 07:33 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
I still don't get why you guys insist on creating 2 mutually exclusive options where it is either 'natural' vs PUA.
To me, those are 2 facets of the equation. There is:
who you are
what you do
Who you are is controlling your mindset, the overall frame when you interact with others.
your social skills (PUA) will make you say or do precise things based on the feedback the other is giving you.
Maybe we can argue which one is more important but in my mind both are important and play a role.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - thor2014 - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 07:46 AM)lano1106 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:33 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
I still don't get why you guys insist on creating 2 mutually exclusive options where it is either 'natural' vs PUA.
To me, those are 2 facets of the equation. There is:
who you are
what you do
Who you are is controlling your mindset, the overall frame when you interact with others.
your social skills (PUA) will make you say or do precise things based on the feedback the other is giving you.
Maybe we can argue which one is more important but in my mind both are important and play a role.
I am sorry to labour on at this but Sarge does not seem to understand what I am trying to say. Its fantastic that Sarge is consistently working on himself and I admire that.
My point is he thinks that learning one gimmick like push and pull got him laid. It might get a girl laughing but she has to see him as a lover and as higher value only then will she sleep with him.
Women sleep with men who are higher value then themselves. This has been a hard coded rule since the dawn of man. Nothing to do with push pull.
Another thing is PUA and game is no longer a secret. In fact just about every woman knows what it's all about. Hot women will never fall for these gimmicks as they have had this stuff run on them so many times. I have seen average looking guys thinking they have tight game run push and pull and girls have just rolled their eyes.
The only way of really becoming that masculine man who women just want to shag is to peel away the layers of negative beliefs we have evolved around ourselves as we have grown up. By learning gimmicks your just adding additional layers whilst DMSI is trying to peel away these layers of negative beliefs.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - JCasterlin - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 08:15 AM)thor2014 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:46 AM)lano1106 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:33 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
I still don't get why you guys insist on creating 2 mutually exclusive options where it is either 'natural' vs PUA.
To me, those are 2 facets of the equation. There is:
who you are
what you do
Who you are is controlling your mindset, the overall frame when you interact with others.
your social skills (PUA) will make you say or do precise things based on the feedback the other is giving you.
Maybe we can argue which one is more important but in my mind both are important and play a role.
I am sorry to labour on at this but Sarge does not seem to understand what I am trying to say. Its fantastic that Sarge is consistently working on himself and I admire that.
My point is he thinks that learning one gimmick like push and pull got him laid. It might get a girl laughing but she has to see him as a lover and as higher value only then will she sleep with him.
Women sleep with men who are higher value then themselves. This has been a hard coded rule since the dawn of man. Nothing to do with push pull.
Another thing is PUA and game is no longer a secret. In fact just about every woman knows what it's all about. Hot women will never fall for these gimmicks as they have had this stuff run on them so many times. I have seen average looking guys thinking they have tight game run push and pull and girls have just rolled their eyes.
The only way of really becoming that masculine man who women just want to shag is to peel away the layers of negative beliefs we have evolved around ourselves as we have grown up. By learning gimmicks your just adding additional layers whilst DMSI is trying to peel away these layers of negative beliefs.
Exactly. I don't understand why any guy would want to be a PUA. The guys that teach that material always sound like used car salesmen
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - SargeMaximus - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 08:15 AM)thor2014 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:46 AM)lano1106 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:33 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
I still don't get why you guys insist on creating 2 mutually exclusive options where it is either 'natural' vs PUA.
To me, those are 2 facets of the equation. There is:
who you are
what you do
Who you are is controlling your mindset, the overall frame when you interact with others.
your social skills (PUA) will make you say or do precise things based on the feedback the other is giving you.
Maybe we can argue which one is more important but in my mind both are important and play a role.
I am sorry to labour on at this but Sarge does not seem to understand what I am trying to say. Its fantastic that Sarge is consistently working on himself and I admire that.
My point is he thinks that learning one gimmick like push and pull got him laid. It might get a girl laughing but she has to see him as a lover and as higher value only then will she sleep with him.
Women sleep with men who are higher value then themselves. This has been a hard coded rule since the dawn of man. Nothing to do with push pull.
Another thing is PUA and game is no longer a secret. In fact just about every woman knows what it's all about. Hot women will never fall for these gimmicks as they have had this stuff run on them so many times. I have seen average looking guys thinking they have tight game run push and pull and girls have just rolled their eyes.
The only way of really becoming that masculine man who women just want to shag is to peel away the layers of negative beliefs we have evolved around ourselves as we have grown up. By learning gimmicks your just adding additional layers whilst DMSI is trying to peel away these layers of negative beliefs.
It doesn’t matter then since like I said I’m already on my mission in life. But push pull helped get me laid along with the other pua tactics I employ. I have never gotten a woman “just being myself”
Ever.
EDIT: or, perhaps using pua IS me being myself.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - mat422 - 07-12-2018
This thread has gone off the rails
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - lano1106 - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 08:15 AM)thor2014 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:46 AM)lano1106 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 07:33 AM)SargeMaximus Wrote: Most of you guys tried PUA and didn't get results and switched to the "natural" paradigm. I had the opposite experience. I had no success with the "natural" paradigm, and so I switched to the PUA one.
So, I don't blame you guys for believing what you do, but I do think you're being a bit closed minded.
I still don't get why you guys insist on creating 2 mutually exclusive options where it is either 'natural' vs PUA.
To me, those are 2 facets of the equation. There is:
who you are
what you do
Who you are is controlling your mindset, the overall frame when you interact with others.
your social skills (PUA) will make you say or do precise things based on the feedback the other is giving you.
Maybe we can argue which one is more important but in my mind both are important and play a role.
I am sorry to labour on at this but Sarge does not seem to understand what I am trying to say. Its fantastic that Sarge is consistently working on himself and I admire that.
My point is he thinks that learning one gimmick like push and pull got him laid. It might get a girl laughing but she has to see him as a lover and as higher value only then will she sleep with him.
Women sleep with men who are higher value then themselves. This has been a hard coded rule since the dawn of man. Nothing to do with push pull.
Another thing is PUA and game is no longer a secret. In fact just about every woman knows what it's all about. Hot women will never fall for these gimmicks as they have had this stuff run on them so many times. I have seen average looking guys thinking they have tight game run push and pull and girls have just rolled their eyes.
The only way of really becoming that masculine man who women just want to shag is to peel away the layers of negative beliefs we have evolved around ourselves as we have grown up. By learning gimmicks your just adding additional layers whilst DMSI is trying to peel away these layers of negative beliefs.
No idea why you call PUA gimmicks. As I said, we agree that techniques alone aren't most of the time sufficient to seduce but they are powerful influence principles that have been used throughout the history to build empires and cults followed by millions of people.
Probably congruence is essential. ie: The best PUA skills cannot succeed if you are someone that the girl doesn't want (but I am sure there exist exceptions to that generality...)
You also appear to have a negative perception of influence. As if it is a bad thing. Everyone is influencing all day long. When you push-pull a girl. This is not something bad you do on her. You create a seduction experience that she craves to have.
I am not sure to see the ethical difference between using a subliminal program to have sex vs using compliance strategies used successfully by compliance professionals (sellers, marketers, politicians, seducers) to reach the same goal.
In both cases, you do something to influence others to get what you want....
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - thor2014 - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 05:10 AM)Zane Wrote: Seriously,Tbh I find Sarge kinda interesting dude...
Cause he has different set of beliefs than many of us here and we think that those beliefs are toxic for him to get laid or in his career yet he is getting laid and making good sales/money from time to time....
I always counted him as an exception...If Sarge thinks that PUA works for him then it works for him..He believes in it..
Main thing is that he is getting laid and u guys should be happy..After all thats what we all want for Sarge..
All kinds of Possibilities exist in this Universe ..Sarge is One of them..lol..I am serious Btw xD
Zane don't get me wrong I am happy that Sarge is getting laid now and he deserves to get laid as he has really worked hard and committed himself to becoming the man he wants to become. I just have a hard time him not understanding as to why he is getting laid. Its like I am trying to explain as to why he is getting laid. He seems to find away around anything I tell him. It's almost like me banging my head against a brick wall.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - Darwinn - 07-12-2018
PUA tactics work when you're starting out. It did for me, and it has done for many. They're a clumsy and incongruent way to either fake attributes of someone who is high value and worth sleeping with and/or exploit the psychological foibles of insecure women. It's not sustainable as a way of life - mystery himself, last I heard, was a basket case.
It won't deal with the fundamental underlying issue of why you don't attract women by being who you are, if that's not important then go for it.
Whether it's smart or not to bang on about PUA while on DMSI well....
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - SargeMaximus - 07-12-2018
Totally agree lano. Great comparison between influence and subliminals.
I’ll also say this: people want to believe there’s nothing they can do to change their circumstances because then it means it’s not their fault. But to take responsibility we must know that everything that happens to us is our fault, for better or worse.
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - lano1106 - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 08:51 AM)thor2014 Wrote: Zane don't get me wrong I am happy that Sarge is getting laid now and he deserves to get laid as he has really worked hard and committed himself to becoming the man he wants to become. I just have a hard time him not understanding as to why he is getting laid. Its like I am trying to explain as to why he is getting laid. He seems to find away around anything I tell him. It's almost like me banging my head against a brick wall.
You both have strong beliefs and cannot understand the other's point of view. that is that simple.
Thor, if you haven't read that book, check the Robert Cialdini principles of influence book.
I would think that it could change your perception that influence tactics are gimmicks
RE: Shannon's Journal Discussion Volume 3 - SargeMaximus - 07-12-2018
(07-12-2018, 08:51 AM)thor2014 Wrote:(07-12-2018, 05:10 AM)Zane Wrote: Seriously,Tbh I find Sarge kinda interesting dude...
Cause he has different set of beliefs than many of us here and we think that those beliefs are toxic for him to get laid or in his career yet he is getting laid and making good sales/money from time to time....
I always counted him as an exception...If Sarge thinks that PUA works for him then it works for him..He believes in it..
Main thing is that he is getting laid and u guys should be happy..After all thats what we all want for Sarge..
All kinds of Possibilities exist in this Universe ..Sarge is One of them..lol..I am serious Btw xD
Zane don't get me wrong I am happy that Sarge is getting laid now and he deserves to get laid as he has really worked hard and committed himself to becoming the man he wants to become. I just have a hard time him not understanding as to why he is getting laid. Its like I am trying to explain as to why he is getting laid. He seems to find away around anything I tell him. It's almost like me banging my head against a brick wall.
Thor, provide proof to back up your claims. do you have a video of me interacting with girls while not using pua tactics? No? Then shut up.
Additionally, do you have a video of me being myself and sleeping with a girl I never used pua tactics on? No? Then shut up.