Jordan Peterson

[Greenduck]

Hi there,

I wanted to make a tread to see if there is anyone else listening to Jordan Peterson, and would love to discuss it. I personally have a hard time to describe him, but I love to listen to his talks, and much of the things he says feels authentic, and he just feels "real" opposed to many other people you see in the public debate.

Jordans central point is that men (and women) need to be competent to move up in the hierarchy. And that we need to put our lives in order to have a recipe for a happy life.

I wanted to share my latest finding from him:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZYQpge1...qtcfjatpOQ

He has also written a book "12 rules for life" which I have at home and are planning to read.

[Fluffy]

I am glad there is at least one unfazed guy out there that can articulate his thoughts in this way. That is for sure.

[Greenduck]

Interesting clip:

Jordan Peterson the devouring mother
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSQ_pZCP...pBG0m0DNMM

In a feminine tyranny of Political correctness, the overprotective mother is the "helper" that does everything to fulfill her mental need for thoughtfulness while at the same time depriving others from being free to do in their own way. You are primarily judged how you are made and how you are perceived and this is not forgotten or committed very rarely if you are emotionally said to be wrong.

In a masculine tyranny, what you materially perform or the physical outcome is that you judged from.

One could say that feminine tyranny is a psychological terror while a masculine tyranny is a physical terror.

This can be an explanation on why there are more men among conservative extremists and more women among liberal extremists.

[SargeMaximus]

I'm not a fan of JP. He seems too intellectual and doom and gloom for me. Plus this whole PC "war" is tiresome and I see it as a shit test not a thing that can be cured so I disagree with him on that.

[findingme]

I listened to the clip Greenduck gave 2 days ago, and one part stuck with me. Near the end, he spoke about how we need to find our purpose. Usually people get very mystical and too disconnected, but I kept listening. He shared we find value in giving back to society via a job or career, and he added we also find meaning in relationships, so that's a reason families are so meaningful to us.

This has had me thinking of me being back in a relationship, something I actually miss. My ex and daughter live about 800 miles away, and I miss seeing my daughter grow up. Raising my daughter changed me for
the good. And Jordan's message has me seeing women differently now. There are loads of attractive women around, but just seeking sex, for me, is not fulfilling. I am thinking of one woman I work with, seeing her differently, like just imagining being with her longterm. The stress to impress dies down soon enough, and that's a focus in short term relationships. So, it's probably both E2 and Jordan's message, but I'm trying to be myself now around women. That is something I can live with.

Thank you for sharing this Greenduck.

[Greenduck]

I'm not a fan of JP. He seems too intellectual and doom and gloom for me. Plus this whole PC "war" is tiresome and I see it as a shit test not a thing that can be cured so I disagree with him on that.

Well he is intellectual, much of the things he talks about have taken a lot of research and thinking to get to. But I don't know why you mean that he is "to intellectual". To me he feels pretty down to earth and giving advice that is pretty easy to incorporate into your daily life.

The PC war is a fight that are needed to take, and is going to be needed for a long time to change the direction of medias current focus, and provide more honesty and less manipulation. This is one of his most important purpose's right now, so I totally can see why he focus his attention towards that again and again.

What do you mean with it being a shit-test?

I listened to the clip Greenduck gave 2 days ago, and one part stuck with me. Near the end, he spoke about how we need to find our purpose. Usually people get very mystical and too disconnected, but I kept listening. He shared we find value in giving back to society via a job or career, and he added we also find meaning in relationships, so that's a reason families are so meaningful to us.

This has had me thinking of me being back in a relationship, something I actually miss. My ex and daughter live about 800 miles away, and I miss seeing my daughter grow up. Raising my daughter changed me for
the good. And Jordan's message has me seeing women differently now. There are loads of attractive women around, but just seeking sex, for me, is not fulfilling. I am thinking of one woman I work with, seeing her differently, like just imagining being with her longterm. The stress to impress dies down soon enough, and that's a focus in short term relationships. So, it's probably both E2 and Jordan's message, but I'm trying to be myself now around women. That is something I can live with.

Thank you for sharing this Greenduck.

Happy to see that insight. I can totally relate with you. Many times I get sucked into some sort of short-term thinking and loose track of what is really important in life, in the sense of what is really rewarding. I can really feel that JBP has an ability to sort this out, and shine light in a way that help you get out of the short-term thinking and looking at the more fulfilling and wholesome stuff. But I think that you need to work continuously on this stuff to change your course of thinking and action, but a start is more than nothing

BTW. I really enjoy following his reasoning, and find myself trying to apply the same clear-way-thinking in other areas in life.

[SargeMaximus]

I'm not a fan of JP. He seems too intellectual and doom and gloom for me. Plus this whole PC "war" is tiresome and I see it as a shit test not a thing that can be cured so I disagree with him on that.

Well he is intellectual, much of the things he talks about have taken a lot of research and thinking to get to. But I don't know why you mean that he is "to intellectual". To me he feels pretty down to earth and giving advice that is pretty easy to incorporate into your daily life.

I began listening to his book on audible and couldn't finish it because it was so long-winded and drawn out till he finally gave the advice "Stand up straight with your shoulders back". As if PUA doesn't already tell you to do that anyhow... He's just too long-winded. Intellectual meaning he doesn't seem to be an "alpha" seems very much a beta analyst.

The PC war is a fight that are needed to take, and is going to be needed for a long time to change the direction of medias current focus, and provide more honesty and less manipulation. This is one of his most important purpose's right now, so I totally can see why he focus his attention towards that again and again.

What do you mean with it being a shit-test?

No see, you don't realize the PC thing has been happening since the 60's. It's not new. It's just a common "us vs. them" paradigm. It's a shit test in that it's designed by nature to separate the betas from the alphas for prime sexual selection. Just like every shit test.

[Greenduck]

I began listening to his book on audible and couldn't finish it because it was so long-winded and drawn out till he finally gave the advice "Stand up straight with your shoulders back". As if PUA doesn't already tell you to do that anyhow... He's just too long-winded. Intellectual meaning he doesn't seem to be an "alpha" seems very much a beta analyst.

I don't share your opinion on that. He actually has a lot of deeper stuff that can be really valuable to read if you just let it sink in and don't let yourself be swayed by your first impressions.

On the Alpha-beta comparison in the field of intellectuals, he is someone who stand his ground regarding his core-beliefs, can listen emphatically to others viewpoints, never looses his temper even under high pressure situations, has a lot of followers who genuinely enjoy listening to him. What do you make of that?

The PC war is a fight that are needed to take, and is going to be needed for a long time to change the direction of medias current focus, and provide more honesty and less manipulation. This is one of his most important purpose's right now, so I totally can see why he focus his attention towards that again and again.

What do you mean with it being a shit-test?

No see, you don't realize the PC thing has been happening since the 60's. It's not new. It's just a common "us vs. them" paradigm. It's a shit test in that it's designed by nature to separate the betas from the alphas for prime sexual selection. Just like every shit test.

Yes sure thing that is has gone on for a while. But just because it has carried on since the 60's doesn't mean that we shouldn't challenge it, quite the contrary. It's no biological "thing" that have arised as some sort of natural selection, it's the work of people with low self-esteem that try to change the cultural norms. That must be challenged, because otherwise we have a cultural system that enforces victimhood and less individual responsibility in various life-areas.

[SargeMaximus]

I don't share your opinion on that. He actually has a lot of deeper stuff that can be really valuable to read if you just let it sink in and don't let yourself be swayed by your first impressions.

On the Alpha-beta comparison in the field of intellectuals, he is someone who stand his ground regarding his core-beliefs, can listen emphatically to others viewpoints, never looses his temper even under high pressure situations, has a lot of followers who genuinely enjoy listening to him. What do you make of that?

None of those things signal an alpha imo.

Yes sure thing that is has gone on for a while. But just because it has carried on since the 60's doesn't mean that we shouldn't challenge it, quite the contrary. It's no biological "thing" that have arised as some sort of natural selection, it's the work of people with low self-esteem that try to change the cultural norms. That must be challenged, because otherwise we have a cultural system that enforces victimhood and less individual responsibility in various life-areas.

It is biological. It came from people, and people are biological. Trying to change it is like trying to change gravity. It won't happen.

As for the victim thing, you NEVER have to be a victim. I remember my grandpa told me a few weeks ago something about some politician. He was like "That guy doesn't care how hard it is for people like us to make a living" and I was ashamed at the level of beta in that remark. I don't expect anyone to care how "hard" it is for me and I always make my own way without expecting handouts.

It's the same with this PC BS, trying to "change the system" is just another beta method to try and get your needs met. Instead, do everything yourself and forget about the system!

[Greenduck]

I don't share your opinion on that. He actually has a lot of deeper stuff that can be really valuable to read if you just let it sink in and don't let yourself be swayed by your first impressions.

On the Alpha-beta comparison in the field of intellectuals, he is someone who stand his ground regarding his core-beliefs, can listen emphatically to others viewpoints, never looses his temper even under high pressure situations, has a lot of followers who genuinely enjoy listening to him. What do you make of that?

None of those things signal an alpha imo.

Why not? Just curious. Sure there are other things that you can strive for to be a full man, but I surely think that the things above is part of that subset.

Yes sure thing that is has gone on for a while. But just because it has carried on since the 60's doesn't mean that we shouldn't challenge it, quite the contrary. It's no biological "thing" that have arised as some sort of natural selection, it's the work of people with low self-esteem that try to change the cultural norms. That must be challenged, because otherwise we have a cultural system that enforces victimhood and less individual responsibility in various life-areas.

It is biological. It came from people, and people are biological. Trying to change it is like trying to change gravity. It won't happen.

As for the victim thing, you NEVER have to be a victim. I remember my grandpa told me a few weeks ago something about some politician. He was like "That guy doesn't care how hard it is for people like us to make a living" and I was ashamed at the level of beta in that remark. I don't expect anyone to care how "hard" it is for me and I always make my own way without expecting handouts.

It's the same with this PC BS, trying to "change the system" is just another beta method to try and get your needs met. Instead, do everything yourself and forget about the system!

I agree with that you don't have to see yourself to be a victim. But just because you are talking about that someone doesn't care about how hard it is for some people to make a living, don't make you a victim. Life is hard for some people. They may not have the opportunity to discover their own potential, or have different burdens to carry. But it doesn't give someone a reason to look down on them.

Victimhood is for me someone who don't want to get support from people around them, who refuse to see a better future, in all situations. That is someone who has taken the stand as a "victim" just to get people to pity them, because of emotional immaturity. But this isn't really something to judge someones real character from, it's just a emotional-disability (even if it may be self-imposed over time).

Well, they argue for their position because in some way they feel that it is legitimate to do so. And I believe that PC stems from an emotional immaturity, and the more I learn about it, and my own psychology, the more convinced I am about that as a fact.

But just to "live outside the system" doesn't really work. We all live in a culture, and are affected by the people around us, and have the responsibility to stand up for what we believe, and to develop our beliefs trying to get in line with reality as much as we can. So I don't believe that we just should "get out of the system" and "go our own way". We need to take responsibility, to debate, argue, learn. Otherwise, going outside all of that is just a cop-out and dodging your social responsibility.

But to not be succumb to stupid people in your workplace, and become self-assertive and able to pursue your goals, that I can agree on, and that is everyones responsibility to stand up for your own authority in life, but those two shouldn't be confused with each other.

[SargeMaximus]

I don't share your opinion on that. He actually has a lot of deeper stuff that can be really valuable to read if you just let it sink in and don't let yourself be swayed by your first impressions.

On the Alpha-beta comparison in the field of intellectuals, he is someone who stand his ground regarding his core-beliefs, can listen emphatically to others viewpoints, never looses his temper even under high pressure situations, has a lot of followers who genuinely enjoy listening to him. What do you make of that?

None of those things signal an alpha imo.

Why not? Just curious. Sure there are other things that you can strive for to be a full man, but I surely think that the things above is part of that subset.

IMO the only signal of a true alpha is if he f*cks tons of hot girls. Dzemoo was one of the few I've ever come across.

Yes sure thing that is has gone on for a while. But just because it has carried on since the 60's doesn't mean that we shouldn't challenge it, quite the contrary. It's no biological "thing" that have arised as some sort of natural selection, it's the work of people with low self-esteem that try to change the cultural norms. That must be challenged, because otherwise we have a cultural system that enforces victimhood and less individual responsibility in various life-areas.

It is biological. It came from people, and people are biological. Trying to change it is like trying to change gravity. It won't happen.

As for the victim thing, you NEVER have to be a victim. I remember my grandpa told me a few weeks ago something about some politician. He was like "That guy doesn't care how hard it is for people like us to make a living" and I was ashamed at the level of beta in that remark. I don't expect anyone to care how "hard" it is for me and I always make my own way without expecting handouts.

It's the same with this PC BS, trying to "change the system" is just another beta method to try and get your needs met. Instead, do everything yourself and forget about the system!

I agree with that you don't have to see yourself to be a victim. But just because you are talking about that someone doesn't care about how hard it is for some people to make a living, don't make you a victim. Life is hard for some people. They may not have the opportunity to discover their own potential, or have different burdens to carry. But it doesn't give someone a reason to look down on them.

I'm not looking down on anyone. It's their life. But I'm just aware that they are only hurting themselves by indulging it. It may be a beta trait tho and some men are just betas.

Victimhood is for me someone who don't want to get support from people around them, who refuse to see a better future, in all situations. That is someone who has taken the stand as a "victim" just to get people to pity them, because of emotional immaturity. But this isn't really something to judge someones real character from, it's just a emotional-disability (even if it may be self-imposed over time).

That is SO strange because, to me, being a victim is someone who always wants help from other people, never stands on their own two feet, are a leech to society because they feel they have it "so hard" which somehow justifies it.

Well, they argue for their position because in some way they feel that it is legitimate to do so. And I believe that PC stems from an emotional immaturity, and the more I learn about it, and my own psychology, the more convinced I am about that as a fact.

Funny again. Because I see engaging in the PC debate as emotional immaturity and yes, I'm aware I'm engaging in the debate right now. Just trying to clarify my position but this will be my last post on the matter because I have better things to do with my time. See below.

But just to "live outside the system" doesn't really work. We all live in a culture, and are affected by the people around us, and have the responsibility to stand up for what we believe, and to develop our beliefs trying to get in line with reality as much as we can. So I don't believe that we just should "get out of the system" and "go our own way". We need to take responsibility, to debate, argue, learn. Otherwise, going outside all of that is just a cop-out and dodging your social responsibility.

I'm not advocating some kind of MGTOW, mountain-man thing. That's preposterous too (and just as beta. True alphas are alphas wherever they go, in any group, and are integrated into society). What I'm saying is it's beta to engage in the debate because true alphas have better things to do with their time than engage shit tests (again, I'm pointing to Dzemoo, not myself. I've got a long way to go before I can call myself alpha)


It's about not wasting time, focusing on your purpose and your women, and not giving a shit about the petty squabbles of the masses. I never have PC convos with anyone unless I want to, and aside from this convo here, it's probably never happened. I just change the subjects because again, why focus on shit that don't matter? If you're not a victim, you don't need the system to change "for you".

But to not be succumb to stupid people in your workplace, and become self-assertive and able to pursue your goals, that I can agree on, and that is everyones responsibility to stand up for your own authority in life, but those two shouldn't be confused with each other.

Or go self-employed like I did and answer to no one you don't want to. But yes, be assertive, pursue your own goals, f*ck lots of hot girls. That's alpha. Intellectual debater is not. Rhymes with masturbator.

[Greenduck]

I don't share your opinion on that. He actually has a lot of deeper stuff that can be really valuable to read if you just let it sink in and don't let yourself be swayed by your first impressions.

On the Alpha-beta comparison in the field of intellectuals, he is someone who stand his ground regarding his core-beliefs, can listen emphatically to others viewpoints, never looses his temper even under high pressure situations, has a lot of followers who genuinely enjoy listening to him. What do you make of that?

None of those things signal an alpha imo.

Why not? Just curious. Sure there are other things that you can strive for to be a full man, but I surely think that the things above is part of that subset.

IMO the only signal of a true alpha is if he f*cks tons of hot girls. Dzemoo was one of the few I've ever come across.

Yes sure thing that is has gone on for a while. But just because it has carried on since the 60's doesn't mean that we shouldn't challenge it, quite the contrary. It's no biological "thing" that have arised as some sort of natural selection, it's the work of people with low self-esteem that try to change the cultural norms. That must be challenged, because otherwise we have a cultural system that enforces victimhood and less individual responsibility in various life-areas.

It is biological. It came from people, and people are biological. Trying to change it is like trying to change gravity. It won't happen.

As for the victim thing, you NEVER have to be a victim. I remember my grandpa told me a few weeks ago something about some politician. He was like "That guy doesn't care how hard it is for people like us to make a living" and I was ashamed at the level of beta in that remark. I don't expect anyone to care how "hard" it is for me and I always make my own way without expecting handouts.

It's the same with this PC BS, trying to "change the system" is just another beta method to try and get your needs met. Instead, do everything yourself and forget about the system!

I agree with that you don't have to see yourself to be a victim. But just because you are talking about that someone doesn't care about how hard it is for some people to make a living, don't make you a victim. Life is hard for some people. They may not have the opportunity to discover their own potential, or have different burdens to carry. But it doesn't give someone a reason to look down on them.

I'm not looking down on anyone. It's their life. But I'm just aware that they are only hurting themselves by indulging it. It may be a beta trait tho and some men are just betas.

Victimhood is for me someone who don't want to get support from people around them, who refuse to see a better future, in all situations. That is someone who has taken the stand as a "victim" just to get people to pity them, because of emotional immaturity. But this isn't really something to judge someones real character from, it's just a emotional-disability (even if it may be self-imposed over time).

That is SO strange because, to me, being a victim is someone who always wants help from other people, never stands on their own two feet, are a leech to society because they feel they have it "so hard" which somehow justifies it.

Well, they argue for their position because in some way they feel that it is legitimate to do so. And I believe that PC stems from an emotional immaturity, and the more I learn about it, and my own psychology, the more convinced I am about that as a fact.

Funny again. Because I see engaging in the PC debate as emotional immaturity and yes, I'm aware I'm engaging in the debate right now. Just trying to clarify my position but this will be my last post on the matter because I have better things to do with my time. See below.

But just to "live outside the system" doesn't really work. We all live in a culture, and are affected by the people around us, and have the responsibility to stand up for what we believe, and to develop our beliefs trying to get in line with reality as much as we can. So I don't believe that we just should "get out of the system" and "go our own way". We need to take responsibility, to debate, argue, learn. Otherwise, going outside all of that is just a cop-out and dodging your social responsibility.

I'm not advocating some kind of MGTOW, mountain-man thing. That's preposterous too (and just as beta. True alphas are alphas wherever they go, in any group, and are integrated into society). What I'm saying is it's beta to engage in the debate because true alphas have better things to do with their time than engage shit tests (again, I'm pointing to Dzemoo, not myself. I've got a long way to go before I can call myself alpha)


It's about not wasting time, focusing on your purpose and your women, and not giving a shit about the petty squabbles of the masses. I never have PC convos with anyone unless I want to, and aside from this convo here, it's probably never happened. I just change the subjects because again, why focus on shit that don't matter? If you're not a victim, you don't need the system to change "for you".

But to not be succumb to stupid people in your workplace, and become self-assertive and able to pursue your goals, that I can agree on, and that is everyones responsibility to stand up for your own authority in life, but those two shouldn't be confused with each other.

Or go self-employed like I did and answer to no one you don't want to. But yes, be assertive, pursue your own goals, f*ck lots of hot girls. That's alpha. Intellectual debater is not. Rhymes with masturbator.

I don't know man... it feels like you stick to a pretty rigid belief system regarding things which make it pretty fruitless to discuss this with you tbh. Hope you don't take it offensive, it's just how I feel reading your replies. Like everything is so damn simple and only revolve around sex, impressing women and money. For me that stuff is just..stuff.

[SargeMaximus]

To each his own Greenduck. Also, it’s not about impressing women, it’s about f*cking women.

[Have at ye]

https://www.thestar.com/entertainment/20...entre.html

I hope there's going to be a live stream of this somewhere, I wanna watch.

My prediction? Zizek by KO. There's levels to this game, Peterson ain't even a contender.