(02-11-2015, 08:10 AM)CatMan Wrote:

(02-06-2015, 02:33 PM)Ricardo Wrote: You shouldn't need to do those things, the sub takes care of them. From what I've gathered you need to be very accurate and careful what you put in your mind (subconscious). Personally my faith is in Shannon's creativity, not faddy unproven and throwaway statements conflicting with the subliminals.

I echo a lot of your sentiments. With respect, I feel the whole thing is nonsense. If it actually works (which I doubt), then you're cheating yourself out of the chance to experience and deal with negative things so they don't affect you anymore. Running from the negative stuff and never dealing with it properly as the subliminal is trying to get you to do...won't get you to where you need to be. You're getting in the way of the entire point of the subliminal, to bring up unpleasant stuff, and make you realise it won't kill you after all and put it to rest and not have it OWN you anymore. It's like the subliminal is a Lamborghini you're driving, but this stuff keeps you in neutral.

Shannon himself even speaks of how the "useful negative" is needed to manifest change. I knew that fact already in life, but didn't phrase it that way. But when I saw him speak of it, instantly I knew what he meant and that we were on the same wavelength.

I've thought for awhile now that Shannon should change the rules, so that only his subliminal is allowed during the program, nothing else at ALL. That way nothing interferes and ruins the results and you have people sadly spending 6 months of their time and getting such a little return.

I have also noticed that the people who do all that stuff seem to stagnate and not really change at all. The people who don't, seem to make measurable change that is obvious. I didn't want to mention this on the forums because I didn't want to badmouth people trying to change. In the end, we're all on our own path, I'm focused on my path, and won't question someone else's because it doesn't concern me and ultimately isn't my business. But if other people are seeing it, then maybe it's good for others to see this, maybe they'll "get out of their own way" so to speak, and allow the programming to do it's job. And maybe Shannon will end up changing the rules of the programs in the future due to this issue to prevent others from sabotaging their own success.

Here's a final thought. I've had this thought since I first started reading this forum. I'll share it with all of you...what IF, this whole tapping thing does cause you to not experience the "useful negative", so you don't change, and in the end, it's an extremely advanced form of fear-based resistance. Ponder THAT for awhile...

(05-07-2015, 05:17 PM)CatMan Wrote: I've said this before, and it got hated on by some but I stand by it, as the proof is on the forum. The "useful negative" is needed for the growing process. Shannon before has used that phrase too, so I know he knows the same thing. Also, there's a marked difference in result in these programs I've seen, between guys who have used this tapping stuff or other things interfering with the programs, and guys who haven't. Ones who have, typically have mixed or anti-climatic runs and have ups and downs and never really seem to make progress with respect. And ones who only used the program as designed and intended, typically more often have solid runs that are fairly in line with the programming. Don't believe my words, go and look for yourself. The spirited debate of such, was a contributing factor to a veteran member being banned recently, so clearly it's a hot topic.

Me personally, I think Shannon should or will, eventually revise the instructions to ban any other form of programming or whatever else, during the use of the program.

Bottom line, I know everyone wants results as quick as possible. I think in the case of tapping and all this other stuff, it's simply too many cooks in the kitchen.

(05-07-2015, 11:32 PM)robstar Wrote:

(05-07-2015, 05:17 PM)CatMan Wrote: I've said this before, and it got hated on by some but I stand by it, as the proof is on the forum. The "useful negative" is needed for the growing process. Shannon before has used that phrase too, so I know he knows the same thing. Also, there's a marked difference in result in these programs I've seen, between guys who have used this tapping stuff or other things interfering with the programs, and guys who haven't. Ones who have, typically have mixed or anti-climatic runs and have ups and downs and never really seem to make progress with respect. And ones who only used the program as designed and intended, typically more often have solid runs that are fairly in line with the programming. Don't believe my words, go and look for yourself. The spirited debate of such, was a contributing factor to a veteran member being banned recently, so clearly it's a hot topic.

Me personally, I think Shannon should or will, eventually revise the instructions to ban any other form of programming or whatever else, during the use of the program.

Bottom line, I know everyone wants results as quick as possible. I think in the case of tapping and all this other stuff, it's simply too many cooks in the kitchen.

As I said before, which you which you conveniently ignored, correlation is not equal to causation. The 'proof' you speak of, is correlative data, which is not proof at all, it is observing that the people who are doing the clearing with subs seem to be getting less results. Are the people attracted to the clearing methods more resistant naturally? Do they perhaps have deeper garbage that would cause them to have sub-par results even without the clearing? Shannon even said that the optimus engine might get people to do more stuff to speed up self-growth, so that could certainly support that theory. Point is, its all just speculation. Your theory is as good as anyone else's. There'd have to be a large enough sample size, and two equally large groups with one doing clearing and one not, for the results to have any sort of validity. Everyone here is just guessing, and both sides think they're right, but its kind of pointless because they're all opinions. If you wanna clear then clear, if you don't then don't, but we all need to stop telling others what they should do.

Quote:I've said this before, and it got hated on by some but I stand by it, as the proof is on the forum. The "useful negative" is needed for the growing process.

(05-07-2015, 02:49 PM)Shannon Wrote: But I can say that releasing the negatives will interfere with and disrupt those programs designed to use those negatives to motivate the changes being sought.

(05-08-2015, 11:11 AM)athanas Wrote:

Quote:I've said this before, and it got hated on by some but I stand by it, as the proof is on the forum. The "useful negative" is needed for the growing process.

Cat Man I'm with you, I remember saying the same thing 6 months ago. Positive emotions tell you what to pull into your life, and negative emotions tell you what to push out of your life. Be normal and have both or be a meditating monk and have none, but you can't have one without the other. It's the yin/yang of life. They are 2 sides of the same coin. People should look up "hedonic adaptation"

Maybe there are things that are useful to clear like guilt/shame/fear as they usually only prevent you from changing. But clearing all negative emotions can't be productive, as you can use some bad emotions also as motivation (e.g. being angry about ppl not respecting you at all). I think there is a reason why Shannon didn't put all negative Emotions into OGSF and only chose those 3, but left anger out of it.

(05-07-2015, 02:49 PM)Shannon Wrote: But I can say that releasing the negatives will interfere with and disrupt those programs designed to use those negatives to motivate the changes being sought.

Exactly this