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Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
10-02-2017, 01:39 AM (This post was last modified: 10-02-2017 01:44 AM by ichigo.)
Post: #2861
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 01:04 AM)Mr. Anderson Wrote:  
(10-02-2017 12:24 AM)ichigo Wrote:  -Return goal scripting to: "“all of the beautiful people of the gender you find sexually attractive”"

This is something I have been thinking about as it seemed to affect really attractive women. However, I also liked the statement from V2.1 but according to Shannon it didn't show very effective in models.

But why do you want to remove ALL snipers? I mean they are focusing the aura at certain persons. And the auto-pilot is in first place to make the user act according to the situation, which doesn't mean the user has to be the seducer.

Again this is just my experience/opinion, but for me, I never had my aura blatantly effect and produce physical symptoms that women were sexually attracted to me as during v1. I know in theory, the snipers should target those women we're really interested in and hit them doubly hard, but in practise, I found that the effect I was having on women was stronger on v1, meaning they became more obviously flustered, flushed, smiley, nervous, giggly, hot, playful, flirty and in a shorter time span than on any of the other versions.

I just wonder if perhaps the snipers are making things too complicated for what should essentially be a simple process: a.) see beautiful person of the gender I'm attracted to, b.) hit them with my sexual aura.

I don't say my word is gospel though. I don't know for sure removing the snipers and returning to v1 method of targeting would improve the sub. It's just a theory. I just know that for me, there was something special that v1 had which has been lost somewhere. For example:

Was it the energy sourcing?
Was it the target of "all of the beautiful people of the gender you find sexually attractive"
Was it because the sub started to try to do too much so the energy for the aura got diluted?
Or was it for any other number of factors only the creator of the program could know about?

It's just something to think about moving ahead to 3.2. I understand it must be very irritating to spend so much work after v1 to get it to 3.1 and then have people like me blabber on about v1.
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10-02-2017, 02:16 AM
Post: #2862
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 01:39 AM)ichigo Wrote:  Again this is just my experience/opinion, but for me, I never had my aura blatantly effect and produce physical symptoms that women were sexually attracted to me as during v1.

I think one point here is energy sourcing - at least in comparison to the next version which has a very safe non-physical sourcing, and another thing is indeed that the aura was projecting like at 100% energy 100% of time, which cost a lot of energy. Not sure if this is the/one reason why the snipers were invented.

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10-02-2017, 08:59 AM (This post was last modified: 10-02-2017 08:59 AM by Adrien Silva.)
Post: #2863
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
Only keep one sniper that activates at full power when you see a hot woman.
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10-02-2017, 09:01 AM
Post: #2864
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-01-2017 08:55 AM)Plouf Wrote:  I ran both by mistake. The media player I was using was retarded.

how are you running apps now?
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10-02-2017, 10:48 AM (This post was last modified: 10-02-2017 10:48 AM by RTBoss.)
Post: #2865
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-01-2017 09:33 PM)thor2014 Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 07:30 PM)RTBoss Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 06:19 PM)Nox Wrote:  
(10-01-2017 03:30 PM)Benjamin Wrote:  Back to the trolling I see thor?

Nobodies forehead got bigger, but yes you aren't meant to be using more than 1 5/5.5g together.

I'm not sure that we can say that dmsi doesn't cause baldness.

Studies keep showing that women find bald men to be sexier.

Which is weird, to me, b/c any time I complain that I have hair that's turning gray, women consistently say, "Hey, if could be worse - at lease you have hair!" But I'm sure our own resident Bald Beauty, Mr. Matteson, would concur with said studies.

Both you and Ben seem to have a personal vendetta against me. Other members crack a couple of jokes and you turn a blind eye. I crack a joke or two and you assume I am trolling.

Ben if you want to go ahead and ban me just do it. To be honest I find it annoying the way you and Shannon treat your customers especially comments in the past. I have no plans to buy any further products from subliminal shop. Its all well and good having a talent for designing subliminals. If you don't have the customer service to backup your business its going to go downhill.

While I didn't say anything in my previous post to provoke that response from you, Thor, yes - if you spout some stupidity or *****, I will call you out on it. You're not special, I call out anyone who does that on a regular basis. It's one thing to write one stupid post, but you write them constantly. I will say you've been a bit better recently, but then you go and say something like Ben pointed out about "foreheads."

It probably would be best if you just remained an observer, or only posted when you actually have something useful to say.
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10-02-2017, 11:02 AM
Post: #2866
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 12:24 AM)ichigo Wrote:  As Shannon's started working on 3.2, and I have some time, here's my 2 cents on the sub as somebody who has used every version since version 1.

If you're letting off an aura of magnetic sexiness, combined with approachable body language and feeling good internally, and combine that with true outcome independence, women will approach. Even if they aren't the type of girl to approach directly, they are more likely to do the things which indicate they are interested, i.e. placing themselves nearer to you, foot pointing, hair flipping, etc.

If she's opened you directly, you just engage in conversation. If she hasn't directly opened you, but she's giving obvious signs, make eye contact. If she maintains it, or looks down and blushes, that means you should approach. You approaching in this scenario doesn't make you the seducer, it makes you the person with ordinary social intelligence who isn't afraid to say hello to somebody out of pleasantries.

Once the conversation is going, in my opinion, nothing sexual should be verbally said. This smells of neediness and a lack of social skills. Keep things vanilla, "hi, how are you, nice weather, isn't it busy here today", normal conversation. This keeps you non-threatening and friendly in her logical brain, and she won't feel like you're trying to seduce her.

However, under the surface, whilst this vanilla conversation is taking place, the sexual energy from the aura is working its magic. You're getting aroused, she's getting aroused. She doesn't understand logically why she's feeling aroused by you, as you're just making normal conversation. She rationalises that she must be very sexually attracted to you. And you're not even trying to make a move on her, you're just being friendly. Now she sees that you're outcome independence, you're not needy, you're the prize.

The longer the conversation goes on for, the more aroused she gets. After a while, if you're observant, the signs will be there to see. Flushed skin, fidgety, probably commenting on how hot it is, etc. Wait for her to initiate some kind of touch, or to take conversation in a slightly sexual direction. She will if you've turned her on enough, which if you're executing the script, with your: a.) Sexual energy and b.) Outcome independence / lack of neediness.

From there, it escalates naturally. She initiated the touch, she's the one seducing. She initiated conversation with a sexual undertone, she's the one seducing. She might be the one to suggest you go somewhere together right now, or meet up again sometime, but even if you're the one who suggests that you both meet up again, or go back to your place right now, or behind that alleyway over there, she will understand that it's still HER seducing you - you're just being a socially calibrated human being responding to her blatant obvious signals that she wants to have sex with you.

I think where we're getting confused, as I've seen said in a few really good posts by others, is that we're sending conflicting signals. If at any point during that interaction, we try to swap roles into being the seducers and show neediness, the spell is broken and she's no longer seducing you. Or our brains are being given conflicting instructions by the subliminal, resulting in our behaviour being in-congruent, and women pick up on that.

TLDR: the sexual aura and our non-neediness should be capable of doing all work. It IS capable of doing all the work, as I experienced on version 1. I think Shannon had it right with the first version he released - it wasn't the features of the sub itself that needed work, it just needed a focus on the anti-resistance tech to get people to execute. So, my (probably unpopular) suggestions are:

-Remove ALL meet them half way / user side seduction / auto pilot scripting
-Remove ALL the snipers, or at least the anti-sniper and the LDS (waste of energy)
-Return goal scripting to: "“all of the beautiful people of the gender you find sexually attractive”"
-Scripting for physical changes to appear more attractive
-Detox scripting for goals of the program
-Fix the sexual performance issue in 3.1
-Plus all the amazing technologies planned, Magnus Engine, etc.

Many thanks and good luck with it either way, I know it's a tough time for you right now.

Agree with all the bold.

What sticks out to me as the main issue for some of us (*cough* me *cough*)

Is the social/conversation skills.

Obviously, if you don't have those, no amount of aura will save you.

Hence why I say we need a module directly focused on that.

Even naturals can benefit from improved social skills. It would take them to a whole new level.
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10-02-2017, 11:47 AM
Post: #2867
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 08:59 AM)Adrien Silva Wrote:  Only keep one sniper that activates at full power when you see a hot woman.

And what's your experience running DMSI? How many versions, how long?
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10-02-2017, 11:49 AM
Post: #2868
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 02:16 AM)Mr. Anderson Wrote:  
(10-02-2017 01:39 AM)ichigo Wrote:  Again this is just my experience/opinion, but for me, I never had my aura blatantly effect and produce physical symptoms that women were sexually attracted to me as during v1.

I think one point here is energy sourcing - at least in comparison to the next version which has a very safe non-physical sourcing, and another thing is indeed that the aura was projecting like at 100% energy 100% of time, which cost a lot of energy. Not sure if this is the/one reason why the snipers were invented.

One other issue I was thinking about with the snipers is how one of them has something like 65-68 different criteria? Is that really necessary? Aren't 5-10 criterion enough? That just sounds really...excessive.
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10-02-2017, 12:40 PM
Post: #2869
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
The idea of focusing the aura on the most beautiful and/or sexually attractive persons the user wants is a good idea per se. Since as for now the snipers don't seem to work as intended for most, then yeah maybe 65-68 crifteria are too much and impede the program's efficiency.
As far as I'm concerned, I don't mind having a sniper that strikes hard the most beautiful women I want, but the baseline aura should project enough sexiness by itself.

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DMSI (24 Days) >> APE + OP (~30 Days) >> DMSI (32 Days)
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10-02-2017, 06:00 PM
Post: #2870
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
Women's strategy is to try to get ahold of the sexiest best genetic stock she can get.

Male strategy is to **** as many women that get his dick hard as possible.


Prioritizing the ultra mega hot chick that might be pretty ***** unattainable for most men (included me) over the cute fuckable chubby over there in the aura firing range is stupid IMO. It should hit as many a girls as possible and as hard (or effectively) as possible.

Leaving behind what ifs and security measures and anti-snipers to the sole users wisdom to protect himself of being stupid
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10-03-2017, 12:50 AM
Post: #2871
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 11:49 AM)RTBoss Wrote:  One other issue I was thinking about with the snipers is how one of them has something like 65-68 different criteria? Is that really necessary? Aren't 5-10 criterion enough? That just sounds really...excessive.

I didn't know there are so many. Less criteria would more likely hit more women I think. I guess the idea behind was simply to find a really, really good match and focus all the energy on that match (what makes the sniper a sniper) instead of shooting around. The question is how effective would be the sniper if 5-6x more people were affected than now.

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10-03-2017, 09:59 AM
Post: #2872
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
I don’t know about you guys but I don’t think the sub needs anything removing like the anti-sniper, there are certain people I’m very glad it won’t be sniping or better said it’ll counter the baseline effect, Shannon knows what he’s doing it’s something else, a while ago I suggested to Shannon about the safety limiters since I know from my higher self that was the issue as to why I wasn’t executing the subliminal his response was:

“I know the safety limiters are good. The difference in definition of what is safe and what your subconscious finds in the script depends on it's definition of "safe", which will be variable and may not actually be accurate. I will have to spend considerable time contemplating how to adjust this, but this may be the key for moving forward with overcoming resistance. So thank you.”

I’ve a very good feeling about 3.2 if the issue is addressed, well then, Yeye

Meh https://youtu.be/Q5pggDCnt5M
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10-03-2017, 12:57 PM
Post: #2873
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-03-2017 09:59 AM)dweller94 Wrote:  I don’t know about you guys but I don’t think the sub needs anything removing like the anti-sniper, there are certain people I’m very glad it won’t be sniping or better said it’ll counter the baseline effect, Shannon knows what he’s doing it’s something else, a while ago I suggested to Shannon about the safety limiters since I know from my higher self that was the issue as to why I wasn’t executing the subliminal his response was:

“I know the safety limiters are good. The difference in definition of what is safe and what your subconscious finds in the script depends on it's definition of "safe", which will be variable and may not actually be accurate. I will have to spend considerable time contemplating how to adjust this, but this may be the key for moving forward with overcoming resistance. So thank you.”

I’ve a very good feeling about 3.2 if the issue is addressed, well then, Yeye

how do you talk to your higher self?
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10-03-2017, 05:55 PM
Post: #2874
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-02-2017 06:00 PM)ImFreeman Wrote:  Women's strategy is to try to get ahold of the sexiest best genetic stock she can get.

Male strategy is to **** as many women that get his dick hard as possible.


Prioritizing the ultra mega hot chick that might be pretty ***** unattainable for most men (included me) over the cute fuckable chubby over there in the aura firing range is stupid IMO. It should hit as many a girls as possible and as hard (or effectively) as possible.

Leaving behind what ifs and security measures and anti-snipers to the sole users wisdom to protect himself of being stupid

I couldn't agree with you more, mate.
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10-03-2017, 06:21 PM (This post was last modified: 10-03-2017 06:23 PM by Determined.)
Post: #2875
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-03-2017 09:59 AM)dweller94 Wrote:  I don’t know about you guys but I don’t think the sub needs anything removing like the anti-sniper, there are certain people I’m very glad it won’t be sniping or better said it’ll counter the baseline effect, Shannon knows what he’s doing it’s something else, a while ago I suggested to Shannon about the safety limiters since I know from my higher self that was the issue as to why I wasn’t executing the subliminal his response was:

“I know the safety limiters are good. The difference in definition of what is safe and what your subconscious finds in the script depends on it's definition of "safe", which will be variable and may not actually be accurate. I will have to spend considerable time contemplating how to adjust this, but this may be the key for moving forward with overcoming resistance. So thank you.”

I’ve a very good feeling about 3.2 if the issue is addressed, well then, Yeye

Ditto. There are guys who are executing well and guys who aren't. This does point to a subjective definition of what constitutes "safe".

The guys who aren't executing seem to think the restrictions are too high filtering everyone out. If their subconscious is marking these people as unsafe, then either they're not ready to handle a woman or be in a relationship yet.

A lot of guys don't understand how terribly destructive a woman can be to a mans life. Ask anyone whose ever dated someone crazy. It gets real nasty. Women always know what to say to hit you where it hurts emotionally. They're attuned to a mans insecurities.

Even most normal women will start behaving crazy at certain points of a relationship. Some men get seriously ***** up by their relationships with women. Women have an incredible talent for being manipulative when they want to be. If you're a guy who isn't ready to handle women in this regard, then she's just going to take you for a ride. Most red pill guys who "hate women" I'd presume they weren't equipped to handle the women they dated and thus ended up being burned by them.

Even women are insecure themselves. Some of them incredibly insecure, more than a man could ever realise. My last girlfriend was so insecure that I'd cheat on her, she deliberately, over time, kept putting up invisible barriers around me. Most of her behaviour was subconscious but it was fuelled by a desire to "keep me". Stick your dick in a woman long enough and she'll start behaving in a similar way. Read Chaosvrgns journal entries, arguably the one guy who executed better than most. He had entire paragraphs dedicated to how he avoided shit tests and maneuvered himself out of situations where women were trying to corner him.

As Plouf rightfully noted earlier, most guys who execute well have had prior experience with women. This might be due to their ability to handle women already being present.
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10-03-2017, 09:11 PM
Post: #2876
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
So here is my opinion on DMSI. Hopefully some of the feedback can be taken into consideration with 3.2.
I started to run the program from 2.2 till 3.1.

1- after some constant hit with the 2x series and switching to 3x the program went out of balance. Meaning some days it works like charm some other days it doesn’t work at all or work negatively... like being ghosted Or hated. So some balance need to be found in the next version.

2- snipers.... in 3.0 I was still getting results and the snipers were kinda awesome but after 3.1. It felt like I was seeking for results way too much. Like I was actually searching for IOIs and looks from women it was way too much to the point I felt like a creep. But in previous versions I didn’t really care and the results were pretty impressive to be honest. Here I feel the problem could be the energy distribution. Maybe we should reduce the number of sniper. I understand that some people won’t like that but I think we are at a point where we really need to make this program work for at least 55% of the users.

3- the aura. I think many would agree that the aura is pretty much gone in the last version. Not sure why or how but it faded. This could be an energy thing again but only shannon would know how or why to fix these things.

4- The anti sniper. Even tho shannon explained about this many times but many still agree that the statement being unhappy or too crazy..etc could have different meanings to different people. Or some users are subconsciously attracted the crazy ones only. I feel the anti sniper should be reduced to be only anti sniper the ones who are infected with STD only. And the user should take responsibility if he chooses to have sex with someone who’s goning to make him unhappy. Again this could be only in 3.2 just to achieve a success rate of 55% or higher.

5- whatever it takes to achieve the design goals- shannon mentioned that 3.1 will do whatever it takes to achieve the goals meaning if you needed to be really healthy to achieve the goal the program will guide you to that or if you need to be really wealthy to get results the program should guide you to that. I feel this script is weak currently and needs to be improved somehow.
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10-03-2017, 09:40 PM (This post was last modified: 10-03-2017 09:50 PM by Benjamin.)
Post: #2877
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
I personally don't think the anti sniper is the issue here, and I agree with Determined the guys that don't want that don't know what crazy women are like. If any of them are going to be taken out I think it's still important to keep the STD one atleast.

I think it's more that the aura isn't at full expression or consistent that is the issue. Alot of us are reporting the inconsistency.

If the long distance sniper was taken away to allow more energy and focus on the normal one then that would be a good thing so it's affecting girls you do encounter not a random girl you don't even know who she is or if it's really doing anything.

More programming for expression of genuine confidence, belief that you're attractive and getting rid of blocks from your expression so you can be really connected with yourself and what you want.

Definite masculinity and Alpha programming is needed too as that's really missing here.

Taking out the meet them halfway so you can sit on your ass I don't like that idea, afterall how many years have you sat around hoping girls would come up to you and they wont? How many other guys have done the same? It's not sending conflicting signals, in fact the times i've naturally talked to the most girls have been the times when other girls have talked to me more. I personally want to uncover more confidence to talk to the girls I want to, which actually in turn helps the other way of having them talking to you too. I feel that you guys are seeing this the wrong way because "yes that sounds good to just sit there and have them come up" and not realize they might just sabotage it if they can't also talk to girls.

And even if it does get to a point it's working really well, not every girl is going to come up still.

And alot of the blockages that are stopping you from talking to girls, going for it and such are the exact same blockages that will have you sabotage it if girls actually do talk to you.

-One suggestion is developing the ability to intuitively know which girls are open to sex, who are horny and such so that you can go for it if you choose to.
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10-04-2017, 01:31 AM
Post: #2878
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
DMSI being experimental, I just think it's wiser to remove all restrictions, get a product that works for most user, then add as many safeties as we are allowed to without screwing up the success rate.
What's the point of the test version if we can't really "test" and see what works and what doesn't.

I believe the anti-snipers may be an issue for some users, not all probably, but for some, yes.
And on a practical level, the subconscious can use them to sabotage the user. And the anti-snipers weight in the script too. But are they really necessary ? Some things should be kept simple really...In opposite to the anti-snipers or the I-don't-know-how-much criteria for the snipers to strike.

Yes, women can be dangerous and ruin your life and so on but this is the user's responssibility to watch out for such cases.
If we can get a working DMSI with anti-snipers, great. But it they break the balance and the program's efficiency for more than a few users, then it's obviously best to remove them.
And the 3.1 version has still the anti-snipers so those who want them that much can stick with it, since, apparently, those who execute it have no issue.

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10-04-2017, 04:05 AM
Post: #2879
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-04-2017 01:31 AM)Plouf Wrote:  DMSI being experimental, I just think it's wiser to remove all restrictions, get a product that works for most user, then add as many safeties as we are allowed to without screwing up the success rate.
What's the point of the test version if we can't really "test" and see what works and what doesn't.

I believe the anti-snipers may be an issue for some users, not all probably, but for some, yes.
And on a practical level, the subconscious can use them to sabotage the user. And the anti-snipers weight in the script too. But are they really necessary ? Some things should be kept simple really...In opposite to the anti-snipers or the I-don't-know-how-much criteria for the snipers to strike.

Yes, women can be dangerous and ruin your life and so on but this is the user's responssibility to watch out for such cases.
If we can get a working DMSI with anti-snipers, great. But it they break the balance and the program's efficiency for more than a few users, then it's obviously best to remove them.
And the 3.1 version has still the anti-snipers so those who want them that much can stick with it, since, apparently, those who execute it have no issue.

Thing is Plouf, that kind of behaviour isn't "watched out for". It's subtle and under the radar. Most times, women aren't even consciously aware they're doing it. Some women in relationships even fatten their men up just so other women won't find them attractive anymore. When you become the apple of a woman's eye (either through incredible attraction or having her sexually addicted to you) she'll start trying to lock you up.

My friend whose a sex and relationship therapist says it best; "A single man is like a tiger, wild and free. When he meets a woman and gets in a relationship, the woman wants to lock the tiger up and make him her own. So she puts a single wall up on one side of the tiger. The tiger sees the wall but still sees three open sides. So he says meh and shrugs it off. The woman puts another wall up, now the tiger is locked in on two sides. Before he knows, the tigers enclosed. What happens to a tiger when put in captivity? It becomes docile. Then the woman starts to panic and wonders what happened to her tiger"

The story above is how alot of marriages end up. Its a side effect of the monogamy paradigm that permeates our societies. It's foolish to believe that any inexperienced man would/could be immune to that.

That being said, I do see the value in going to the other end of the spectrum and having a viable product first without the limitations. Though if this were the case, then most guys here would have to learn the hard way which isn't pleasant.
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10-04-2017, 04:15 AM
Post: #2880
RE: Develop Maximum Sexual Irresistibility 5.5G discussion thread
(10-03-2017 09:40 PM)Benjamin Wrote:  I personally don't think the anti sniper is the issue here, and I agree with Determined the guys that don't want that don't know what crazy women are like. If any of them are going to be taken out I think it's still important to keep the STD one atleast.

I think it's more that the aura isn't at full expression or consistent that is the issue. Alot of us are reporting the inconsistency.

If the long distance sniper was taken away to allow more energy and focus on the normal one then that would be a good thing so it's affecting girls you do encounter not a random girl you don't even know who she is or if it's really doing anything.

More programming for expression of genuine confidence, belief that you're attractive and getting rid of blocks from your expression so you can be really connected with yourself and what you want.

Definite masculinity and Alpha programming is needed too as that's really missing here.

Taking out the meet them halfway so you can sit on your ass I don't like that idea, afterall how many years have you sat around hoping girls would come up to you and they wont? How many other guys have done the same? It's not sending conflicting signals, in fact the times i've naturally talked to the most girls have been the times when other girls have talked to me more. I personally want to uncover more confidence to talk to the girls I want to, which actually in turn helps the other way of having them talking to you too. I feel that you guys are seeing this the wrong way because "yes that sounds good to just sit there and have them come up" and not realize they might just sabotage it if they can't also talk to girls.

And even if it does get to a point it's working really well, not every girl is going to come up still.

And alot of the blockages that are stopping you from talking to girls, going for it and such are the exact same blockages that will have you sabotage it if girls actually do talk to you.

-One suggestion is developing the ability to intuitively know which girls are open to sex, who are horny and such so that you can go for it if you choose to.

I have a friend whose sole mating strategy is to go to a club and find the women who are ovulating. He says its the ones who are glancing around the room, though to the untrained eye it'd be easy to miss.

Agree with the signs of women who are open to sex, I think that's paramount.

Also agree with masculinity and alpha programming. Strong sense of self is sexy. Might also help Shannon in developing AM7.
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